John: I have never felt better in our relationship than I was when I was single because—

Nicole: Hold on, say that again. You never felt better in our relationship than you were when you were single?

John: Like, I feel so much better in our relationship than I did when I was single.

Nicole: Okay, that's like, I've never felt better being in our relationship.

John: No, no. You felt the best. You've never felt better being single than you have felt being in our relationship.

Nicole: I think that's your—

John: Sure, I was, yes. That is what I mean. Beyond the perfect, we discovered through our flaws we complete each other better than perfect. We stay through every fault; we find our way. Alright, welcome back to the Better Than Perfect podcast, where every week we share with you how two imperfect people helping each other grow equals one better than perfect relationship. He's mastered it. He's got it down packed.

Nicole: Well, as you guys can see, we are not in the middle of the ocean anymore. We are back. It's kind of sad, but it was an adventure coming back. Forty—it was a 50-hour day, but 40 hours of travel. So that was a lot. Sleep schedule is finally getting somewhat normal. John is definitely not—

John: I think so. I took a lot of melatonin last night, and I feel better now, but I feel like a little bit back to normal. I feel like more back to normal than you feel, but that's good then.

Nicole: Yeah, it definitely took a lot. As you get older, too, then it does—

John: Admitting to being old right now.

Nicole: Hey, I'm older than you, so that's true. And I always will be.

John: That's right. So, unless you—and you know, time travel or you know, get into a really fast spaceship that goes close to the speed of light, so which is—which I have one of those, so watch out. But yeah, so we're back and—

Nicole: Ship. Okay, before we go down space travel, uh, topic zone, anything else you want to add for our things that came up? And I mean, I don't know, like, there's some topics that came up that were—I know I saw one from what's his name this morning. What's his name? The guy from Australia. What's it, uh—oh, uh, I can't think of his name right now. Is his name Zach?

John: No, it's not Zach.

Nicole: Jake?

John: Jake Madok, that's it. Yeah, check him out on Instagram. He's good. But he did a reel that a lot of people were pissed off at. He's doing a lot of them like, but he said that it basically started off with like, "Screw your career, like who cares about who gives a flying about your career, you know?" Uh, you know, and he was telling this woman like, "You know, she's like, 'I don't think I'm ready to give up my career,'" and like, and the man, it was like, wanted her to help him with his business, and he would take care of her and start a family and stuff. And so Jake was like, "You screw," and then there's a lot of women in the comments that were like, "A woman has to have a backup plan. She can't put, you know, like the whole thing." And so, and then I responded. My comment was—

Nicole: I didn't do anything. Oh, you commented?

John: Well, yeah, because I was like, this is, you know, but I said to a lot of the women that were saying that, I was like, "Look, you got to be all in, 100%." I was like, "Do you want a man that's not all in, that has a backup plan and plan B, that's like, you know, if this doesn't work out, I need to make sure I got my—?" You don't want that, right? And I said, because one of the women cited that, you know, so many marriages end in divorce, and I was like, a lot of those marriages are marriages where people aren't all in, right? They have a backup plan. Yeah, so it's like, yeah, you get like the whole "give up your career" advice. I think that is good advice to give to women, and all the women were like, "This is so dangerous advice," and it's like, you know, I mean, get what he's saying, and I get what you're saying, and I agree with you.

Nicole: I have to give the woman's side of it, though, and it's that if a woman enjoys what she does, that's the hard part. Because I'm not saying that she shouldn't focus on being a mom, and that she should give up her career, like not give up her career, right? But if it's something that she really enjoys doing, and plus two, if she's really good at it, especially like if she's in certain positions where she's developing something that can help a lot of people or certain things like that, then that is really hard to give up. Whereas like, if you're just working a job, and you want it as a backup plan, that's not a good excuse because, like you said, then you're not all in, and you wouldn't want a man that's not all in, right? But, you know, there is—I feel like as long as in that situation, she's still given the opportunity to pursue the things that she likes to do, then it's not necessarily an issue. But if somebody is like, "Give up your job, just stay home," sort of thing, that and like, you know, you have to let that go, you can't do it part-time, you can't like do it as a hobby or anything like that, then that is a little bit harder for a woman to swallow because it'd be weird to say she loses her identity, right? And like, well, a mom will—I'm, let me finish before you get jumping down my throat, uh, the—a woman is always going to have the identity as a nurturing, motherly figure, even if she does not have children. To our core, that is what being feminine is, and that's what being a woman is. But at the same time, as a human being, you need the things that interest you in your life to feel like an individual.

John: Because every woman has that motherly figure, every woman is nurturing and caring deep down, whether they show it or not, right? That doesn't differentiate her from anybody else. But if she's a mother who likes to dance, and so she goes to her dance classes, or she is a mother who likes painting, or she's a mother who really believes in this charity and is involved in it and volunteers to help people do—like, those things help make her feel like her. Like, in my instance, that is what makes me feel like Nicole rather than just any other woman out in the world, right?

Nicole: And not every woman is acting in a motherly way or in tune with her feminine side, but it's the hobbies and the things that make her her that are important. And so that's why if she's attached to her career because it's a part of her passion in life, then she needs that in some degree. I'm not saying that she needs to be a full-time person doing that, right? But she needs to be able to still do those things in her life to keep her feeling like her and to keep her happy. Like, I'm not saying she can't be happy just being a mom, right? But I don't know any mom who is just a mom and does nothing for themselves and is, of course, like super happy. We're talking—

John: Hobbies, we're talking—

Nicole: Yeah, no one should be restricting you and being like, "I don't want you to do anything besides stay home, watch the kids, and make sandwiches." I mean, I would—

John: Say, like, even part-time, I don't know about if the man's asking you to take care of the household and the children, and support me and help me, then I say no, not the part-time, no, especially if he's willing to take care of you. Because the thing is, you still have the roles, right? And also, it's to become one. So yeah, there's an identity, but you have an identity as a couple, you know? And I think that's more important than that individual identity. But I don't think anyone should restrict you from doing your hobbies and things that you want to do.

Nicole: Yeah, I understand what you're saying, but I think it is a little different because you're coming at it from a perspective of you're providing everything, so you get the freedom to do whatever you want. And I think that you could... I'm not talking part-time where it's like a more almost borderline full-time, but every few days going in to do something that they're passionate about, and that they're good at, and that they're valued for, is not necessarily a bad thing.

John: No, it's not necessarily a bad thing. I'm just saying, you know, it's a matter of you don't need to work, you don't have to provide, doing a part-time job, but you can do whatever you want to do in terms of passion, dancing, hobbies, those types of things. It's just, don't interfere with the role of the masculine role and being in the feminine role. I think that's a better way to explain it because I think men sometimes don't understand why women jump down someone's throat for saying that stuff, and vice versa. Women don't understand why men jump in, and they get so upset about certain things. And it's because, and I can especially view the woman's side because one, I am a woman, and two, women value safety and a safe environment so much. But a lot of women who are saying stuff like that, they are afraid of losing their identity. And like, even in the empowered wife book that we're reading, which is similar to the surrendered wife book that we already reviewed, she talks about the way that her marriage got better was actually by focusing more on herself.

John: Exactly, and what she wants to do, rather than focusing on her husband. And that's not to say that she's just being selfish or whatever, but I think it goes more along with what I was mentioning to you, that a woman still has to do things that she likes to do.

Nicole: Right, yeah. So let's say a woman likes to paint, right? When you give the reign over to a man that you trust, and you are able to stay home and take care of your family, you also have more time because you don't have to go to work to do those things in a way that's also not stressful. Like, you're not on a deadline, you don't have certain things that you would necessarily have when you're working. And plus, it's not like a job, but you could even sell those things on your own time with like an Etsy shop.

John: Right, yeah. Again, it's not to have your own stash pile of money, but it's that if you wanted to have that's what I'm saying, like part-time, something light like that, that doesn't interfere with providing for the family or being there to support your husband and your kids.

Nicole: Yeah, but still allows her to have those things because women, it's kind of like men when they say something, and they hear something totally different, and they go on this tangent. When a man says something like that, she's like, "Oh, he's saying I can never do anything. I can never leave the house, and all I can do is make sandwiches and spend time with my kid and my husband," which, like, it's not like she doesn't want to do that, but she hears, "Okay, I can never do anything ever for myself again. It has to be all about them." Well, a lot of the women in the comments were talking about the idea that it's too much of a risk, that if she does get a divorce, then she won't have skills, and those were the arguments they were making against it. Or, you know, "Why should she have to give up her career?" Which is legitimate to some degree, but at the same time, as someone who doesn't work right, but has worked before we got together, I don't really have a fear that if, God forbid, something happened to you and I, which I don't think would happen, that I couldn't go out and find a job.

John: Sure, yeah. But even, yeah, that is not... And that's not what they were saying. They're saying if you can trust the man, it's like you get into a marriage 100%, you don't think about an alternative Plan B. You're in it, you're to become one, like all of this is a unification. So, right, you can't be thinking individualistic when you are in a marriage. You have to think about becoming part of the whole. And so, that's the issue, is that they're trying to mitigate the risk. Just like, you know, we talk about this all the time, mostly we talk about men trying to mitigate the risk and not being all into it, or not even wanting to take a risk in marriage at all because... But also, you just made something light up in my brain that I'm like, "I can't wait to say this." But so, are so afraid that women are going to take all their money, but yet women want to keep their jobs so that they still have money when they leave. How does that work? If she only wanted to take your money, she'd be like, "Yeah, I want to stay home, pay for everything, and then I'm going to take your money when I leave." No, she's trying to have her own money so when something happens that she's prepared. It's not, she's not trying to... So, how does that math work? The math ain't math. That's the math because people like to whine either way, you know what I mean? People just want what they want. Right, the guys want to say this thing, the women want to be like, "Oh, I'm an independent strong woman. How dare you tell me I can't have a career? I don't need a man." That whole thing, and that's where, you know, Jake was just saying like, "Stop it. Who cares about the... You're trying to get a 10 out of 10 relationship. You got one. You got the guy. Just, you know, no one cares about your career. Just, you know, stop it. Don't jeopardize this on something that's not even that important to you as you know you're here trying to get. If it's not that important to you, then definitely look for a relationship with a masculine man that is going to take care of you and provide for you. Go to the 50-50 on there's plenty of guys at the end of the day that are still going to stick to that. They're not going to listen to our advice, and there you know, like you said, go in that situation." And like we've just been talking about, that if you...

John: If you're with a good man, he will give you the opportunity to partake in the things that you like to do and that make you who you are, while giving you the freedom to not have to work and to focus on your family.

Nicole: Exactly, yeah. And that's valuable. It's a better way to explain it. I know it's probably edited just to ruffle some feathers. I'm sure. I mean, he's just, you know, off the cuff. But again, it comes down to the same thing. The most immature, childish behavior is whining about, "You can't tell me what to do. I can do what I want to do." That whole, "I'm not going to listen to anyone. No one's my boss." Well, both sides do those things. It's childish. Look, if you don't want someone to tell you what to do, interact with them. Then you don't have... No one can make you do stuff, you know? So, unless they got a gun. Jeez. And even then, you have a choice. That's why I just don't like the victim mindset. I don't have any empathy for it because it's like you're making choices. No one's... You don't need to assert yourself and tell everyone that you have free will. We all have free will. Surprise! We know. We don't have to do anything. No one can make us do things.

John: Right. Well, one thing I want to, before we move on to the actual topic, is that what I think is important in this conversation is that women need to realize that if a man is willing to provide for the whole family, that is him investing 100% in you.

Nicole: Exactly. And you have to realize that as a woman, it's not trying to control you. I mean, maybe there are some men out there that are using it as a control tactic, sure. I'm trying not to generalize things. But for a majority of men, if he's going all in and telling you you can stay home, that's because he's going all in on you. Because if you think about it, if you guys did, God forbid, get divorced, it's his income that he's been providing. And as we all know, I'm sure every person has seen men in the comments somewhere, you can look at our videos, and they're like, "I'm going to lose half my stuff." So, if a man is willing to lose half of his stuff if you guys get a divorce, right, because he's been the one getting the money, not saying that women aren't doing anything to provide to the household, but he's providing financially, right? He's investing 100% in you. And so, instead of meeting that with, "Well, I want to have my nest egg in case we divorce," you need to realize he's investing 100% in you, and you need to invest 100% in the relationship.

John: Yeah. And then you can still do the things that you like to do, but like I said, it's not... I mean, within reason, you know, your hobbies, the things that you enjoy, and get the freedom of not being on that time constraint. Because there's plenty of stuff going around the internet, right, where there now people are starting to realize that women and their monthly cycles and just their feminine nature and how our hormones are not geared to deal with stress the amount that we are stressed out. A lot of jobs, and men can handle that because they have a 24-hour sort of hormone, and women have a 28-day, I think it's 28 days, hormone cycle. And so, it fluctuates for women. And some days, when like our testosterone is up, yeah, we're like a guy. We'll be like, "Yeah, let's get this stuff done." But then there's other days, like when we're in our menstrual cycle period, and we're like, "I just want to lay here and rot in bed." And so, it's harder for you to continuously act one way, right, when you're on this roller coaster of hormones. And so, some people have embraced that. Like, some women have been like, "Wow, this is true, right? And I'm going to embrace my femininity and my feminine side and realize that I don't like being stressed out all the time." And it really does give you that... I'm not saying that nothing ever comes up and you're never stressed out because staying at home and being a mom is stressful. It's in different ways. It's still a job. Like, you're still doing a job, and you're doing the most important job. No offense to you, but you're raising the future of your family. Like, you are more so influencing... I'm not saying that the father doesn't at all, but if a mom's staying at home, she's with the kid the majority of the time. She has a higher influence. Men are essential also in having a family and influencing their children, but the mother is the one that is there the majority of the time, and that is a huge job in itself. And so, when you have the stress from that job, you don't want the stress from a career.

John: Yeah, yeah. You want to be able to focus 100% on that. And like you said, the women who want a career, then you need to find a man that wants that for you guys as well.

Nicole: Yeah. And good luck, 'cause it's not going to be the kind of relationship you want. Like, well, and it's really hard. Not like you might think it will, but it's not going to be because that's going to be the guy that's not willing to step 100% up. But you know, well, and I get that some people, it might be that they're in the position that they just don't have the luxury right now to do it. Like, I know my parents worked really hard to provide for my brother and I, and I understand that. But at the same time, they were both working so much that my brother and I didn't get as much time with them. And that is a choice. And like I said, I love them. Like, I understand now that I'm old enough, and when I was old enough, that they did it to provide for my brother and I. And I'm glad 'cause I got to do things because they did that. But at the same time, they had to give up something to do that.

John: Exactly. And I get that wasn't an easy choice to make, but it is a choice. Whereas if a man's providing 100% now, at least one parent is with the child most of the time. And what do I tell men all the time? Like, when are you ready to date? Not until you're older, not until you're old enough, well, also till you can financially support a woman, right? And a child typically comes with you. Not a lot of 20-year-old men can financially support a family. If you cannot financially support a woman and children, if you're going to have children, then what business do you have dating as a man? Like, if someone comes to my house to date my daughter, and they're like, "I don't have a job," like, what's your intentions with this young lady then, right? She's going to be my sugar mama? No. I mean, you got to think about it, right? 'Cause like, you know, and she's young now, but I'm saying, like, let's say she's in her 20s or whatever, like, you're going to talk to him.

John: Your intent, his intentions, is either to get what he wants, we'll keep it PG since we're talking about her, or it's to marry her and have a family, you know what I mean? Or to just play around, just have fun. So, if his intentions are pure, which is to have a future together, then you need to be able to provide. Otherwise, I'm going to assume your intentions are the other. Don't even come to my door unless you got the money to be able to support her. Otherwise, why are you dating her? That's the thing. But good luck to her boyfriends in the future; they better step up. That's how it used to be. I would have the audacity to meet someone's dad, not knowing I couldn't take care of his daughter. I'd feel like I didn't have any shoes on, you know what I mean? Like I just showed up without shoes on. I would feel so raw, embarrassed. Who am I to stand here and talk to this man about his daughter when I can't even take care of her? Are you kidding me? So anyway, my point is, if men follow this advice, then it won't be a problem in the future.

Nicole: That's true. Well, that was like half of the episode. Oops. I was going to say one other thing too, though, because I think this is important. The biggest thing that women screw up in a relationship could be a whole episode. But let me tell you, because I've been doing a lot more relationship coaching with guys lately, and I can tell you over and over again where women screw this up. It's trying to show how strong they are to the man instead of being vulnerable. When the woman is vulnerable, the guy crumbles. He's like, "Let me help you." She gets through to him immediately. But when she's soft and vulnerable in an argument, whatever it is, right? When she's like, "I'm the alpha chick in this relationship," or like, "I don't need you," or she tries to show how tough she is, that's not going to attract a man by showing how independent and strong you are. So, the biggest thing that women screw up is showing how independent and strong they are instead of just showing how weak and feminine and soft and vulnerable they are. When you come to a man like that, it takes everything out of him from the argument. You can completely control a man just by doing that. Now, I'm not saying that you should, but I'm saying you have so much power as a woman when you do that. And I'm seeing this more and more as I'm coaching guys.

John: Yeah, and they might get upset over that. Even if it's not, they don't feel like it's an act, it's something that they've adopted that isn't natural to them. It's because they got hurt somewhere by being vulnerable, so they put on this facade, right? And they fully believe it and embody it, and that feels safer to them.

Nicole: Yeah, but you're right. I mean, I struggled with this sometimes. I still even struggle with this because as a woman, when you are vulnerable, or anybody when they're vulnerable like that, the second somebody stabs you when you open up your guard, take your armor off, you never want to not wear that again. Men are the same way. So, women are terrified to show their softer side because they feel like they'll be hurt again like they were the first time. But what women need to realize, and like you said, is that you can be vulnerable and not allow a dagger to your chest after you took your armor off to hurt like it did the first time. It's still going to hurt when you're vulnerable and somebody still lashes out at you or treats you poorly when you are trying to come to them in a very vulnerable state. But when you realize that you decide how you react to something. So, let's say you're vulnerable and someone abuses that or someone hurts you while you're trying to be vulnerable because it's not to say that men are going to 100% do the right thing when a woman's vulnerable either. Men might still lash out at a woman, right? Especially if he's upset because his needs weren't getting met or something. He might see that as an opportunity to really dig at her, just like women do the same thing, use when men are vulnerable to really dig at them because that's when you can really hurt somebody. Anybody. You have to realize that you can decide what you do with that. You can decide whether it was a big enough dig to draw a boundary, which is probably what you should do, where it's like, "Look, I came to you in a vulnerable, kind way, and you treated me this way. And so, in the future, if you talk to me that way, then the conversation will end, and we will only continue it when you can come to the conversation in a calm, collected, also vulnerable way," or whatever you want to say. Have a boundary or straight up leave if you feel like that person has shown you constantly that they cannot handle treating you with care in a vulnerable state. But like you said, most men will because they don't want to see a woman hurt. But women also don't know how to be vulnerable because they have put up that guard for so long that even when they're trying to be vulnerable, it's not true vulnerability because there's still a part of them that's trying to hide it because it's so precious and it's so sensitive.

John: Exactly. Yeah, you'll see too, in that book, she has a whole section on it on how to do it, which I think is good, is useful. But yeah, I agree with you 100%. It is hard, and women aren't used to doing it. But right, I can tell you from, you know, again, when I'm coaching these guys, there are all the things like, I'm like, "Okay, a woman doesn't have to do that necessarily in order for the guy to be like," the guy can bring it out, right? But it's a shortcut for a woman in a relationship if she realizes, "If I do this, I'm going to get a much better response from the guy," you know, especially if I.

John: I'm consistently showing up this way, right? So, if you just consistently show up as a woman, as vulnerable and soft, and you're not trying to assert yourself and trying to show how tough you are, you're going to have a lot better experience. Which women don't want to do that; they feel like that's what they're supposed to do. Maybe this needs to be a whole episode at this point because you've even seen it, men being like, "I don't want another dependent. Why can't women do stuff for themselves? They're so weak. Like, you're a woman; you're so weak." And like, they use the things that make a woman feminine and weaponize them against them. And so, women want nothing to do with that because they don't want to be with somebody who thinks they're weak. And they think they see men talk like this.

Nicole: And they assume that all men think this deep down, even if a man tells you different or even if he doesn't act like those guys. She's believing what those guys are saying. Well, when you say weak, what do you mean by weak? Like, why is that a bad thing?

John: Well, like a woman can't take care of herself. Like she's a weak, defenseless little... She's just emotional and can't do anything for herself.

Nicole: Oh, well, okay. I mean, that's... I wouldn't really call that weak.

John: Well, a lot of men use that, and they use women being emotional as them being weak and not able to handle things.

Nicole: Right, that is not... No, it is true in the masculine viewpoint of how things should go. You see what I'm saying? It's like their world, but they're not like... They're not women. Like, if it comes to, you know, going and hiking up a thing, and I'm going to do all this stuff, and then it's like, yeah, women are weak in general. But what if she hikes up there with you?

John: Some women can do that, right. But most women, they don't... They're not going to be able to do the kind of work. Like, I know that, you know, as a man, and most men know, it's like, yeah, like a woman's not going to be able to handle the kind of stuff that you deal with on a daily basis. She just... She wouldn't even be able to handle it, right. So, but here's the thing, okay, I'm getting to the good part of this. That's the masculine viewpoint of the man's world, as if that matters, right? And so many men get stuck on this, and they're like, she just... She just doesn't have any ambition, and she just... She needs to toughen up. She... Like, life, like a little thing in life, smacks her around, and then she's... You know, she can't even stand on her own. She doesn't even... Isn't even equipped to handle life, right? And we've had some people we know that have said these things, exactly that. You know what I'm talking about. But that's such a wrong viewpoint because that is doing exactly what you're saying. It's making that into a bad thing. It's like, she's delicate, right? Look, I'm not saying that women can't do things, but you need her to embrace the delicacy. And when you're making that a bad thing, it's like, yeah, maybe she can't handle life as good as you can. Maybe she doesn't have the toughness that you, but that's why you're valuable as a man. Because that's why she's a woman, and that's why you're protecting that. You're enveloping that. You're being the thing that's taking the beating and keeping her delicate and soft, you know?

Nicole: Yeah, but more men need to perpetuate what you're saying because I've never heard any man say what you just said. Never in my life. And that's the whole thing is what I'm trying to tell you. And all these men who are expecting women to be feminine in the face of the majority of men saying things, saying how women are weak or not like other men or can't handle her emotions. And I'm not saying that those things aren't necessarily correct, but that demonizes femininity, right? And pushes them further from finding the woman that encompasses that. Because a woman will never be feminine, right, unless she's around a man who understands and appreciates femininity. And these men say they want femininity, but they don't appreciate femininity. They are downplaying it. They are talking bad about it to the point where women, and I was one of these women, don't even know what femininity really is because men have made all of the traits seem horrible. They have made them not even appealing to women.

John: Right, oh yeah. They're like, "Why? Well, why would you do... Why would you be so emotional? Why would you do this?" But men aren't doing that on purpose. There it's ignorance, right? Because it's like still having the...

Nicole: Yeah, I agree with you. They're judging women by the man's world ruler, and they're... And she's falling short, and then they're criticizing her and say she needs to be able to take care of herself. Like, how can she even survive in this world? I don't even understand how, like, without me, she would just wither away. And they're making that be a bad thing, right, when that's a good thing, in the sense that, like, I'm using extreme language, but what I'm saying is that that's good, that she depends on you, and that she... Like, now women don't want to depend on men, and that's caused a lot of this problem. Because they have actually made women become somebody that doesn't have to depend on men. To at this point, women can live without men. They don't want to. They can because they have been pushed so far into this narrative that we're talking about. They can live without men. So, in order for her to find the value in a man now, right, you have to be a diamond in the rough. You have to be a man that supports her and protects her and allows her to open up to her feminine again because so many women have been pushed here. Like I said, I don't know any other man, right, who has explained how valuable femininity is. And that's also what women don't understand is because, like, women now are trying, I guess, to show other women how valuable femininity is. And I'm not saying that they need a man to tell them that femininity is valid, but if they heard even just this, like, hopefully, these clips get cut up real good because if they heard a man talk about femininity the way that you just talked about, they would have hope that, well, there are other people out there who embrace the femininity rather than trying to diminish it. And it's confusing because, like I said, I'm not saying that women just follow everything that they hear or see men say, right? But when you constantly have men putting women down for their feminine attributes but yet say they want feminine women, right, they don't even understand what they're asking for. It's so confusing, and women would rather take on masculine traits and just be alone and learn how to be on their own than be with these men who say they want feminine, but when you're in a relationship with them, they're like, "Why are you being so emotional? You're just weak, and you need me." They're like, "I want an orange, but I want..."

John: It's like expecting an orange to taste like an apple. You can't because they're fundamentally different. That misunderstanding often comes from ignorance. I've had coaching calls where guys complain about how the smallest things bother their partners, not realizing the difference in what they each can handle.

Nicole: Exactly. And when men expect women to be just as tough as they are, it creates a problem. Women trying to meet that expectation just leads to more issues. It's like measuring a man's ability to wear a dress by how big his shoulders are—it's an inappropriate comparison.

John: Right. Men often use a masculine yardstick to measure women, which doesn't value the strengths women bring. This is similar to how some men can't understand that women might not prioritize visual attractiveness as much as they do.

Nicole: Women need to embrace their femininity and not feel pressured to conform to masculine standards. If a man can't appreciate that, he's not the right partner. It's about insisting on being yourself and not letting the world change you.

John: That's a powerful message. Owning your femininity and being vulnerable is a strength. It's about being true to who you are, even if it means showing emotions like crying, which society often views as a weakness.

Nicole: Exactly. There's power in vulnerability and femininity. It's not about being weak; it's about knowing your strength and using it. If being vulnerable leads to being hurt, it's better to express that hurt and set boundaries than to hide your true feelings.

John: Being vulnerable means speaking your truth. It's about being honest about your feelings without fear of how others might react. That honesty is where the real power lies.

John: It's not like they have anything that you didn't offer up. So when you're being vulnerable, just speak your truth. Even if somebody tries to make a joke about you, because I guess that's what people also get afraid of, is like, they're going to make jokes about it. They're going to be like, "She told me, I heard her feelings." Okay, every single person in this world has had their feelings hurt. So if somebody tried to use my vulnerability against me, I'd be like, "I spoke the truth and I expressed how I was feeling. Like, okay? I don't understand where you're trying to use that against me."

Nicole: What you're talking about is how vulnerability makes you invulnerable and makes you bulletproof. Because if you're like, "Oh, that hurt. Oh, that stings. Oh, actually it's funny," in that book, "The Empowered Wife," she says, "Ouch," just outright. She said that in the other one too, yeah. And it's like when you do that, then now the stuff can't actually affect you so deeply because you're already out there all the way. And your response to someone hurting you is, "That hurts." So it's like, it almost makes you invulnerable because nothing can really, you know, the things still hurt, but they can't destroy you, you know what I mean?

John: Well, and now you're getting somebody's reaction based on your true feelings. Because if you're not being vulnerable and you're upset about something and you're yelling at your husband, now he's responding to your yelling. You feel like he's responding to your sadness, but really he's responding to your reaction. Whereas if you're vulnerable and you're like, "Ouch, that hurt me," he has to directly respond to your emotion or your right, like topic of what is bothering you. There's no anything in front. So if he doesn't treat you well by that, you also get his pure reaction, and you can make a decision like, "Okay, I came out here and I was vulnerable, and I did this, and he treated me this way. That's not really how I want to be treated." Especially if I'm giving him this raw emotion and there's no fluff in front for him to defend himself, and he's still going to come and attack me.

Nicole: Yeah, that is something that a woman would need to consider. Not a good guy to be with.

John: Exactly. You wouldn't want to be with somebody like that. A man that can watch a woman being vulnerable and showing her weakness and like just cry, you know, and can respond in a negative way. And again, maybe a slip-up, you know what I mean? But then realizing it. But to just be able to see that happening and then not be pulled to comfort and protect her, that's a bad man. That's a, you know, it's like, you know when kids torture and dissect animals and stuff, and they're like, "Okay, like serial killer." You know, it's like the same type of thing. Like, you can't, there's something broken inside you as a man if you don't respond. It's like a woman that doesn't respond to baby cries. Women respond to baby, you know. So if you're a mother and the baby's crying and you're just, oh, like in "Oppenheimer," right, when we were watching that movie, right? He comes home from work, she's drinking, the baby's just screaming, you know, and she's not phased by the baby crying at all. That's a bad sign, you know what I mean? Something's wrong.

Nicole: So it's the same thing if a guy doesn't have a response to that. He should have a response to that. There's something wrong if that's so. That might be a guy that is a bad guy, you know, like a really to the core bad guy.

John: So yeah. And it's hard to learn how to be vulnerable as a woman who has put her guard up and has lived for a long time with her guard up. It's not going to be an instant thing, but it's worth learning, and it's worth committing to continuing to do and try to do even if you mess up. Don't give up and just put your armor back on. You need to learn how to continue to be vulnerable and realize that you create your own safety. Like you said, when you're vulnerable, you actually become invulnerable.

Nicole: Yeah, and that I think will help women because they're already in this mindset where they have to be strong and they have to be independent. So if they realize the strength in being feminine and even the independence, like we talked about in the very beginning of the episode, that a man gives you when he takes on the masculine things in your life and provides for you, so you have the freedom. Like, this is the true femininity. This is the femininity that women want.

John: Exactly, yeah. And that they'll feel the most comfortable in. And it's hard. And I want to say one thing about the power thing too. 'Cause here, I got a book for you, "The Art of Seduction" by Robert Greene. So in that book, he talks about seduction, but really a lot of it is about feminine power. Because one of the examples, the classic one, is Cleopatra over Marcus Anthony, you know, and you know, Cleopatra, he's running the Roman Empire, right? So but she's controlling him. Now, she controls him for manipulative purposes, but it's her feminine power that controls him. So you take, as powerful as a man can be, a woman will always be powerful because you can take the most powerful, successful man in the world, and a feminine woman can control that man. You know what I mean? And again, I'm using the word "control" because I'm being extreme. But what I'm saying is that she has power over the man. A man, however powerful he is, the right woman, right, that acts in a feminine way, the Damsel in Distress, he's still going to respond to the damsel. He's still. So I guess women don't realize how much power they have by being feminine. Because, you know, I'm not saying to cry crocodile tears and, you know, but if you're authentically expressing yourself and being feminine, you're going to have a big sway on a man. Let's say that you're in an argument about you don't want to move to North Dakota or whatever, and he's taking a job in North Dakota, and you're like, "It's not fair. You shouldn't make us move to North Dakota. I don't want to. I'm never going to like it. Like, you don't care about me." Okay, but then instead of that tack, you say, you just start crying and you just say, "I'll do it, but I just, I'm just so sad." And it just, I don't even think you would say "I'll do it," 'cause I mean, she knows that. I think the feminine response would be like, "I'm really worried about making new friends or finding new things," like talking about what you're actually worried about, right? And then that is the way to get a man to understand and talk about how it makes you feel, not like in the way, like you said, being like, "You don't think about me," but talking about your actual feelings about why.

John: Are you afraid, or what makes you scared of moving? Like, what are your concerns? Like, "I'm going to miss my family that's here." You know, if you live near your family, like things like that, is a better way to handle it than, like you said, exactly. Yeah, just being, you know, 100% and crying, you know, being you. He's going to come to your rescue. I mean, maybe you're not even going to move to North Dakota, or maybe...

Nicole: He's going to care about all those things and try to fix those things and then make you feel better that you want to go. But ultimately, at the end of the day, if you're acting like that and you don't want to go, he would give up his job, he would give up his career. I mean, I can't speak for all men, but I'm saying as a man, that most men would do that. He would try really hard, yeah, if there's any other way, you know. So, but that's the thing, is like, taking that approach, you have so much more power, right? And women don't realize that. But, and again, that's why I'm saying it goes back to a majority of men perpetuating these negative things about women that are actually the feminine qualities that they supposedly want, but they are causing women to be further and further away from that, right? Because a woman doesn't want to be vulnerable; she doesn't care about being vulnerable; she doesn't care about looking weak or anything like that if she doesn't have a man that values that, right? Like, if she feels like no man values the feminine qualities, yeah, then any woman's going to just not follow through with those, right? Plus, if she's more masculine, she feels like she can handle her own life rather than if she was like feeling like, "Oh, I'm so weak," or "I'm just sad all the time," like that's going to, and she's single, right? That's just going to push her further in a direction that men don't want women going either, which is more of like depressed and hopeless.

John: Well, yeah, I mean, and not, and, and I'm saying this because a woman can be feminine and single and get her stuff done, and that's what I'm trying to say is most women are in that state of their life, right? Exactly. And so they just need to shift when they get into a good relationship and realize the power that they have in the femininity. Now they can really get into their feminine energy because now they've had, they have a man that takes over the masculine part that she had to do, which is like take care of the bills and go to work and things like that, the more masculine traits, and now she can just focus on this half of her, whereas in when she's single, it is more split, yeah, of course, yeah. And so in order for her to survive, but a woman, like we've said in the beginning, if you have a man that is investing 100% in you by telling you, "Hey, I'll handle all the finances. I'll work so you don't have to. You can stay at home and handle the home and the family matters and things like that, and then you can still have the time to do what you want to do and be in your feminine energy," then what more could you want as a woman? And if you realize the power that you have, like you said, right? As a woman, and the power in being vulnerable, and that nobody can hurt you unless you allow them to hurt you, right?

Nicole: Yeah, exactly, yeah. So, it's like a mindset shift, and don't listen to the guys that talk bad about femininity. Like you said, those are not the guys for you. Like, like you said, if you get into a relationship and you're like, "Hey, I'm a feminine woman, and I'm going be upset sometimes, but I'm working on, you know, also have accountability. I'm working on the way, way, yes, and I will be vulnerable, and I'm very nurturing and caring, and I will live in this soft sort of place," yeah, and that's who I am, and someone tells you, "I don't want that. Go get a job," you know, that they're not for you, right? And, and it's again, it's your chance to become the magical unicorn, right? Because, you know, it's like a guy that understands these things and will treat a woman, you know, that in a masculine will be masculine and treat a woman in a delicate feminine way is a unicorn, is a rarity, right? But it's the same thing if you want the unique trait to being a woman that a man is going to be like, "What?" You know, it's going to be that. It's going to be like consistently showing up as vulnerable and soft, you know, and not asserting yourself, not trying to act that way because if you constantly are like that, guys are like, "I've never seen this before," you know? So, well, and you get a sort of confidence too when you come at somebody with like, "This is who I am," right? And they don't have to, you have to be okay with them taking it or leaving it, sort of thing, and that will make you the happiest too because you know somebody is there for you.

John: Yeah, well, I guess this is going to be, we were going to talk about not having friends of the opposite sex, but you know, this is well open to this. See, no, it's good. I think it's a good topic because, like I said, I've been doing a lot of coaching lately, and it's like, and, and you know, I could talk about all the things that the guys are doing. You saw my little lead magnet that I made that had the five, you know, but, well, there are things that women are doing, so it is important to talk about it. It's just like, it, to me, it's like, it's not even like a, like a nitpicky, it's, it's just like if women understood how much power they had by being, having a feminine response, a soft response instead of a hard response because when I'm talking through these things with these guys, I'm like, like I agree, like I, I'm like, "Dude, I agree with you," but like, "You're the leader. Let me tell you." I was like, "Yeah, if she acted that way, that would be wonderful," right? I was like, "But you can't assume that's going to happen." So, I'm giving him the advice, but then at the same time, I'm also thinking, "Man, if women could hear this, like if I were coaching women right now, if they could hear this, what this guy is saying, and like a hundred other guys that are saying the same thing, they would approach arguments a lot differently." Like, they would be like, "Oh wow, if I just start crying and I act feminine, he's going to..." Don't just start crying, not crocodile tears, like, but, and instead of the anger response, if it's natural to cry in that moment instead of the anger response, allowing the hurt response, you see what I'm saying? That's what I'm saying. That's the authentic response because the anger response, like you said, it's a facade. It's a fake response. It's not real. It's hiding the hurt. Every anger hides a hurt, you know? But, but if women understood that, if they did that, how much that would move these guys and completely, you know, they would do it because it's just, you know, it's the same, like the insights that I, that I try to give you where, where it's like...

Nicole: Where guys, I don't know if guys understood that if you, and understood how to emotionally...

John: Validate a woman, that she doesn't care about whatever happened. She cares about knowing that you care about how she feels. And all you have to do in the conversation is literally just let her authentically indicate to her that you care about how she's feeling right now. That ends the entire thing. There's never going to be an argument, and she's going to love you for it. Then, I feel like guys would do that, you know. But again, maybe it's the same thing because I tell guys this, and they're like, "No, it doesn't work like that. She's wrong." And it's like, so they're still committed to defending themselves.

Nicole: It's the Magic Bullet. It's like men have a Magic Bullet, women have a Magic Bullet. Men's Magic Bullet is to really understand how to emotionally validate a woman and just focus on that and not explain away, no defending. And women's Magic Bullet is being vulnerable, and you know, soft and crying. You know, like doesn't have to be crying, but you know what I'm saying. Expressing their hurt, letting their raw hurt be seen in front of a man. If you expose your raw hurt, then the man is going to crumble, no matter how tough he is. The tougher he is, the more he'll crumble. Which I've already told women what to do, and I'm not saying that they shouldn't do the things or any of those things. Let me preface all this stuff, but one thing that men do need to do, regardless of anything, is learn how to appreciate the femininity for what it really is. Not have the man goggles on and viewing a woman as trying to fit her into the man standards. Truly appreciating femininity.

John: Right, and outwardly showing that. I'm not saying like comment on something that you wouldn't normally comment on just to be promoting this stuff. But if you see some sort of content, like our content, right, and it's talking about this, and you leave a comment, if you're like, "Yeah, I agree with that. I didn't understand that. I was maybe looking at it at a different..." Say those things because women are paying attention to that. And women will tell you that they're not influenced by a man. They are, to some degree, no matter what. I'm not saying in every single way, but they are.

Nicole: Yeah, and women have seen plenty of men talk about how they're weak and they need to man up, basically. Like, that sounds ridiculous, but you know, or that they're acting dependent like a child. And, you know, me myself, I've had somebody tell me, "Oh, you just want to stay home 'cause you don't want to work." Like, men perpetuating things like that pushes a woman further from her femininity. And yes, it is women's responsibility to still be in her feminine and to find that power in being soft and vulnerable and feminine. That is true. But the more that men are demonizing or like trying to put down femininity, they will never get the feminine women. It'll be harder. Like I said, it's still on women to be that, regardless of how men are acting, but men really need to be champions of femininity rather than tearing it down.

John: Yeah, yeah. And like I said, a lot of it is ignorance because they don't even understand that. Like, you know, like that comment you said of, "Oh, you just want to stay home, and you don't want to have to work." It's like, the man, that's the... Like, she's not a bro. Like, you're not... You didn't make a business partnership, you know what I mean? Like, that's not the deal. It's not like you're just 50/50 equal. Like, she's... You're getting the wrong viewpoint because as a man, I'm like, "Oh, well, if I add one more resource to my household, then we'll have double the income, and then we can, you know what I mean, but we only have to have one house, so we have 50% of the same expenses but double the income. That's smart, right?" It's like, yeah, from a strategic standpoint. But she's not a resource to be used. You know what I'm saying? Like, guys are thinking of it that way. It's like, "Well, you know, I'm tough, and I can handle these things, and then if she's tough and she can handle things as well, then together we're this huge shield." You know what I mean? We're a shield wall. It's like, no, no. You're the shield wall yourself. So that's why guys are thinking this way because they're thinking from a man, a strategic, like this makes us stronger when we're both making money, and we're both stronger. It makes sense from a logical standpoint, but what they don't understand is it just makes you bros. Like, you might as well just have a fraternity, and then you can all, like, pull each other, you can make a commune of all dudes, and you just pull each other's money together, and one guy not working hard enough, you kick him out, or you know, beat him up or whatever it is, you know. And you can just, you can do that.

Nicole: Romance, make a Syndicate or whatever. But my point is that the weakness that you're missing in that is the feminine part of things, which is valuable and prized. And that's what, you know, I think we were talking about in the other episode, is like, yeah, about the, like a piece of art, right? Like, and you're like, "Well, what does it do for me?" And it's like, "Does it make me... It looks beautiful in your living room. Can it grocery shop? Can it house?" It's like, you can't... You know, that's why, "What does she bring to the table?" Like, it's like, again, these are not questions. These are not things that men are willfully doing because they're trying to be jerks. They just are ignorant, a lot of men, because they're looking at it completely through this masculine lens of the world, which is good for them, right? But you can't look at women that way because you're missing that value. 'Cause it's like, she's a piece of art.

John: You know, even this morning, one of the guys, you know who I'm talking about, that I mentor, he was complaining because you were in the podcast episode we did on Josh's podcast, that you were more centered, and I was more to the side behind. And I was like, "Look," he's like, "You should be the center, and she should be to the side." And I was like, "Look, it's giving Anthony Johnson like lean in, you lean." I was like, "Look, my woman, okay, my woman, she's going to be in the front, and I'm going to give her the good seat, the comfort seat, and I'm going to make her, you know, let her present well and look good for everybody, okay? And I'm going to take a side to that. That's because I'm a gentleman, and that's how gentlemen treat a lady." That's right. And so, and the only person who needs to know that I'm the man is her, and she knows it.

John: I don't need to show it to the rest of the world. I don't need to be like, "Look at me, I'm the man, and she's the woman there, right?" She will show that to the world. I don't need to show it; I don't need to prove it to the world. I only need to show it to her. If she believes that I'm the man, I don't care what other people think about that. You see what I'm saying? And that's the thing.

Nicole: But I will say, as a woman, it's getting kind of old to say that it's just ignorance because there's plenty of stuff out there now. There's this whole episode, and so, the thing is, I think some men too are ignorant, you're right, some are stubborn, and they don't want to adapt to what we're saying even though they know it's true, right? But like we've been talking about, that's going to end up just being unhappy. Like, if you're not willing to accept the reality of things, if you're trying to always put a woman into men's standards, you're going to have a very masculine woman, and then you're going to be like, "Well, why aren't you feminine?" You made her this way, exactly. Yeah, like you've talked about that, you know, women are the garden, and men water the garden. Yeah, like you're putting her in a masculine garden; you can't expect to have feminine flowers in a masculine garden. And that's the thing that I just don't understand because you're right about that. It's like, but guys don't understand it. They don't understand what feminine is; women don't even understand what feminine is for the most part. It's like, that's why this is so important. Our Gospel that we're preaching because, you know, because the thing is, when you don't understand it, then it's like, okay, I want a woman that stays home and takes care of the kids and, you know, all these things. But then it's like, but that same woman has the attributes of not having a job. It's like, pick one.

John: If she's going to work, and then you expect her to come home and do all the normal things, and she's going to be emotional, she's going to be because those things. So, it's like, if you pick one, I'm okay, right? If you're like, "Look, I want a woman. There's no such thing as masculine and feminine; we're all equal. It's all a social construct, and so a woman should do 50% of the share of everything. She's just, you know, she shouldn't be exempt because she's a woman." So, whatever, yeah, maybe she has some physical differences, but financially she can do the same. She should be able to handle the same mental toughness, all that stuff. And so, that's what I want. I'm okay with that. I'm not going to argue with you. If you think that that's fine and you're good with that, then I don't think it's the best way, but sure, at least from an idealistic standpoint, I don't say that you're an idiot. Or if you say the other way, if you're like, "Okay, I want to be the man, and I want her to be the woman, and I'm going to be the masculine. I'll take care of all the bills, and she stays home, and she, you know, I take care of her, and I protect her." I'm okay with that. What I'm not okay with is when you try to combine the two. You want this from this buffet over here, and then you want to go over. It's like bringing your Subway sandwich into a five-star restaurant. Like, you can't do that. You can eat a Subway, or you can eat at the Michelin restaurant. You don't get to take the Subway sandwich and eat it over here, you know what I'm saying? It's like, you have to pick which one you want.

Nicole: I agree. And I think people, because you're talking about mental toughness, which as a woman, I'm like, mental toughness, and some women win long races in the middle of the desert. So, yeah.

John: Yeah, no, it's true, right? And so, what I need both men and women to realize is that when people say we're not the same, which is what we say, right? That does not mean that one is below the other, right? Women have a variety of attributes that put them right here, and men have a variety of attributes that puts them right here. On that sense, we are equal. I think the yin and yang is the best way because they're composed of the same colors, but they are bulging in different areas, and they are composed in a different way to fit together as one cohesive unit, right? But you, it's not like one is men are better than women or women are better than men, right? They just have different things and different amounts of those things, right? In order to make up who they are, right? And you could do either. Like, like you said, there's, I forgot her name, but she does amazing 300-mile race, and she, you know, know her, she's got a huge amount of mental toughness. Okay, now that is a more masculine trait, but a woman could develop that masculine trait. That's fine, just like, hey, as a man, I could probably become really, really good at ballet. Okay, I'll teach you.

Nicole: Right. I could do it, right? But you know, the things associated with that would be more feminine traits, right? But I could, you know, it's just that not only am I at a disadvantage because that's not my natural inclination, like I don't have a natural strength there, but I could still develop it to better than men have an advantage in dance because there's not that many, so they're put on a pedestal. But besides that, it's okay, you know, a different example, but you know what I'm saying.

John: Yeah, but just like, you know, the woman that wins those races, I wish I could remember her name, but, you know, she might not have started with the mental toughness that a man might have started with, but she superseded almost all men, right? So, you could still choose those things, but not only are you not better suited for it or better equipped, but you're also not better suited. It's not the thing that's probably going to make you happy. It could be harder, and then, you know, but I'm just saying that it's like a mixture because maybe she's really masculine in that sense, and that she does that, but maybe in a different area, she's super vulnerable and feminine and knows how to do that. And so, it's like, it's not black and white, and it is a lot to it. But what everyone needs to realize is that we should both be embracing the differences in each other because it's when we come together that it makes us feel the most whole and the most like ourselves than we've ever felt. Like, I have never felt better in our relationship than when I was single.

Nicole: Hold on, say that again.

John: You never felt better in our relationship than I was when I was single. Like, I feel so much better in our relationship than I did when I was single.

Nicole: Okay, that's like, I've never felt better being in our relationship.

John: No, no, you felt the best. You've never felt better being single than you have felt being in our relationship.

Nicole: I think that's your—

John: Yes, that is what I mean. Like, I've felt immensely better in our relationship.

John: I had a different perspective on relationships when I was single. People often talk about the freedom they have when single, but for me, it was carrying a lot of baggage, both masculine and feminine, and it was stressful. This relationship has been the easiest, most loving, and softest experience of my life, offering nothing but benefits. You allowing me to sit in the comfy chair and not feeling the need to project your manliness because you're secure in who you are is a true mark of a man. Women need to recognize when someone is willing to invest in them 100% and embrace their feminine attributes, finding power in being soft. It takes more strength to be soft in the face of hardness.

Nicole: I agree. Being hard is easy, which is why women often resort to it when they're not being vulnerable. But being vulnerable is hard for anyone. It's like in an MMO game, where you have a tank and a healer. The tank takes the damage while the healer supports from behind. In a relationship, choosing to dive deeper into our roles, masculine or feminine, creates synergy, making the relationship stronger. The title for this episode could be "Vulnerability Makes You Invulnerable."

John: That's a good title. We don't have any arguments to report; we've been traveling a lot and getting along well. We spend all our time together and are still not tired of each other, which is why our advice is worth listening to. Thank you to everyone leaving us iTunes reviews.

Nicole: Thank you. And to the person who left the review mentioning "banana fingers," we're not sure what it means, but thanks for the five-star review. Hopefully, it's nothing inappropriate.

John: Yeah, hopefully not. If you'd like us to read your review, just leave one. Maybe your fingers are so long they're like bananas.

Nicole: Alright, see you next time. Goodbye.

John: Jesus, John, why would every fault we find our way?