John: Guys complain to me all the time, "Why does a woman get to vent all of her problems onto me, but I can't? Women are more emotional and they need to vent. The man is supposed to be the support; he's supposed to be the rock. If something is going wrong on the ship, right, and the captain's like, 'Oh my God, I don't know what we're going to do,' and he's panicking, how much confidence are you going to have in the captain?" What about the captain suppressing his emotions and then causing problems beyond the perfect? We discovered through our flaws. We complete each other. Better than perfect, we stay through every fault. We find our way. Welcome to the Better Than Perfect podcast, where we share with you every week how two imperfect people helping each other become better equals one better than perfect relationship. All right, here we are. So, it's your turn this week for the topic.

Nicole: Yes, it is. And I feel like I have a pretty good one that's not really something that we can fully answer. I already know how you feel about it, but it is a complicated situation, so I am excited. I did give you the topic so that you could ruminate on it a little bit, but I already know how you feel, so it'll be interesting to kind of dive deeper into that and explain our point of views while also thinking about how other people view it.

John: Okay, alright. So, I guess that means I should tell you all what it is now.

Nicole: Yes, and we are going to talk about 50/50 in relationships.

John: Okay. Define what is 50/50. Most people think of the 50/50 financially, right? Like they think of, like, "We're going to both pay the bills and do this," and like, you know, 50/50.

Nicole: But you kind of hinted at this, too, earlier when we talked about it briefly, that, you know, sometimes it's also 50/50 emotionally or in other ways. And so, I thought it would be a perfect topic to kind of dive in and just go into it, even though I do know that it, I feel like this is a very situational sort of thing for each couple. I know you don't necessarily feel that way. So, I guess I'll explain my side about it, and then you can kind of go into how you feel. So, back when I was dating M, I kind of had a weirder perspective on dating. Like, I would go on a first date, and I would never assume the guy's going to pay for it, but I had plenty of friends that would be like, "If a guy doesn't pay on the first date, I'm not interested in him anymore." And like, yeah, it's a nice gesture for a guy to pay on the first date, but at the same time, I viewed it as, like, "Look, I don't know if I'm going to like you, you don't know if you're going to like me, right? So, like, I can understand coming at it from like a 50/50 sort of thing that way, like we each pay for our own meal or things like that because like we don't know where this is going." So, I'm like, I'm cool with that. But like, as it progressed, again, I wouldn't like expect it per se, but like, it would mean more, like as time went on, that like this person is doing this thing for me because they care about me, type of thing, or you know, that sort of situation. I was in a very 50/50 relationship, and it felt so transactional to me, like more so than even like my friends, and that felt weird to me. Like, it felt weird that like when we went out, it was like, "Oh, well, you got this, so like, you need to pay for that," 'cause like, I would go out with my friends, and we would never even act that way, right? So, it just, it kind of tarnished the relationship. I mean, the relationship had its own problems, but what I'm saying is that like, it made it so transactional that it was like almost uncomfortable feeling. And you know, I was making less than this guy, right, you know, which is pretty typical, and I was still paying the same amount that he was, which in my mind, I don't think like, it is bad to have some sort of dynamic where a woman pays for stuff and a guy pays for stuff, but I think it should be based on salary type of thing.

John: There, I would disagree with you because if you truly want to 50/50, it has to be equal. So, it does, you know, if you make...

Nicole: But I'm not saying I want a 50/50.

John: ...that it would balance the tables out more because, like, think of it from my perspective in that instance, like, I'm like, we're going out to dinner, uh, and like, we go to a nice dinner, and we get a nice bottle of wine. Now, I'm going to be eating Ramen for the rest of the week, right, you know? And he's got, you know, all the things, which is the problem with 50/50, 'cause if it's going to be equal, then it's going to be equal pay, regardless of how much money you make, because that's what 50/50 truly is. Otherwise, it's not 50/50, right? So, that's why I understand that, that's why I'm against 50/50. This is my perspective, though, so like, that is what I think would have balanced it out more because then, like, we could have been on the same sort of playing field. And I didn't even necessarily mind that I was contributing. Like, I never expected to not, like, you're the first person that I've been with that I don't have to do that. So, like, I never was expecting that. And I think some people might see our relationship and be like, "Oh, well, she's probably just always let the guy pay for everything." Like, I even told you, I think when we were first dating, that like, if I didn't want to see a guy again, I would pay for the whole date because I'm like, "You know, let me treat you. Yeah, this will be the last, then we're done," you know? Like, make it a good little parting gift, like, you know, you got a free dinner, and so I let you down easy. So, like, I was never the type of person that would be like, "A guy needs to do this." I had a lot of friends that were old school and like would tell me that they would be upset if a guy didn't pay for a date. Sure, but at the same time, I'm pretty sure a lot of those people are doing some sort of 50/50, or like, they're two contributing households, and like, my parents are 50/50 type of people, so I grew up with that. It's not necessarily like I didn't see those things, you know? I didn't grow up with like our dynamic, but right, right. There is something that I feel like, like a man doesn't have to pay for everything in your life for you to have some sort of security, like, you know, around that, or like, but it's the effort that they put in, right? Because like, I had also dated some guys that didn't have a ton of money and couldn't, you know, pay all my bills, but they did other things that made me feel like they were still supporting me. Like, they would, you know, give me some flowers every once in a while, like, you know, they wouldn't make me be...

Speaker 1: Like, alright, here's your Excel spreadsheet of like, you owe me $7.50 for this cocktail that you got at dinner. And that's also the extreme, I do realize that. And it does work for people. People do it. No, it doesn't work for people. People do it. It doesn't work for people. And part of the reason why it doesn't work for people is exactly what you said. If you do a 50/50 and you don't pay attention to the incomes, then that becomes a problem if someone makes more than the other person or if that changes over time. If you do pay attention to the incomes, and now it's like, now you have an unequal, like, well, wait a minute, why are you contributing less? You're bringing less to the table because we're looking at this transactionally. So you should go to college and get a better job, or why don't you upgrade your skills? You're lazy. Like, you see what I'm saying? Now I'm paying more money, but I feel like if you think like that, do you even care about the person, really? Because it's like, you would want to put in a little extra because you have a little extra, in order for you guys to be on the same playing field. As far as, like, look at it this way, what you just said, if you're really looking at it that way, I would say that you don't care about that person. So, back to the story of like, I'm paying exactly the same, and now I can only eat ramen for the rest of the week. Also, at the same time, it's like, now I can't afford to get you a nice Christmas present because I don't have the money left over because of all these things. You're going to do another job, but besides financial...

Speaker 2: Okay, yeah, but okay, let me give my take on that part then. Okay, since, okay, so I believe that, I get it. I mean, I get the whole idea behind the 50/50, and there is, to give a caveat here, there are women that take advantage of men paying for things or expect men to pay for things, right? And don't expect that they're contributing in any way, that they're just taking advantage of the situation, and especially of nice guys. However, as a man, I do firmly believe that a man should pay for everything, and there's several reasons for this. One of them is just to avoid the 50/50 completely because there's no way to do a 50/50 that works. Because either you're going to have the problem where you treat everything straight down the middle, and it's transactional, and then if one person makes more money than the other, that person always feels like they're getting the short end of the stick. Or you have to subsidize the other person, in which case the other person feels like, why am I subsidizing you? So it just turns something that's a relationship into transactional when you start to count the dollars in any way that you do that, and it's just not good.

Speaker 1: I have a quick question. Okay, so since you do support us, right? Is there ever a time where you feel like I'm not providing to you?

Speaker 2: Absolutely not. Because I'm the man, right? Because, well, and there's several reasons for this, right? So first of all, just as a man, the man, a man and a woman are different. The masculine and the feminine are different, and that's really what the point of this podcast is, to help people by helping them realize that in order to have a better than perfect relationship, you have to recognize the masculine and the feminine and the different roles because we're not the same, we're not equal. We are different, right? And those differences actually make something that is better than perfect. That's the whole idea, you know, 1 plus 1 equals 3, it's synergy. And so the thing about it though is being the man, it means assuming, we talked about last episode about being the captain of the ship. Okay, so if I'm the captain of the ship and I'm steering the ship, right? And I'm responsible for the ship, and I'm responsible for everything, then I have to be accountable, which means that I have to be the one that is financing the operation. I have to be the one that, I can't have the authority without the responsibility, and the responsibility means taking care of everybody on the ship. It means making sure that financially everything is taken care of. It means doing all of those things. And so you can't really have that authority because as a man, I do expect in the relationship to be the authority. I do expect that as a man to be able to be the leader, and if I'm not paying for everything, if I'm not taking care of everything, everything from a financial perspective, then how can I really assume that role, right?

Speaker 1: So what if you couldn't provide?

Speaker 2: Then I'm not ready to be in a relationship with a woman. In fact, that's how it used to be in the old days. You have to make enough money to be able to support a woman, or you shouldn't really be in a relationship with a woman if you cannot support her. I believe that because, again, the same guys that will argue against what I'm saying right now, because I know a lot of guys get upset about my viewpoint on this, they complain about single mothers and they complain about single mother households and women raising weak men. And the thing about that is that, or women not being there to raise their kids. Well, in order for a woman to be there to raise her kids, a man has to be able to provide enough for the entire family so that she doesn't have to work. And there's nothing wrong with women working. Women can do a great job, but the thing is, it's more beneficial for a family if there's one sole provider, and you have one caregiver who's able to take care of the children and be the nurturer, right? You know, and that's why that family dynamic is one that almost all people would argue is a stronger family dynamic. Now, some people will say, oh, that's not possible in modern society today, everything is too expensive, in which case it's like, well, then maybe you're not ready to start a family, maybe you're not ready to get married. If they're never ready, then hey, as a man, life is hard. Like, you know, a man, you're always in competition with other men. There's never going to be a time as a man where you're just going to be, just, you know, a woman's life is different than a man's life. And there, women are always in competition with other women as well, too, society in a different way, right? A man has to be able to survive on his own, and he's not really a man if he can't take care of himself and take care of other people. A woman doesn't have that same issue. A woman, she will be taken care of, right? Whether her father or family or...

Speaker 1: Or herself.

Speaker 2: Or herself, but a man,

John: A woman doesn't have to worry as much about that as a man does. A man does have to outcompete other men and he has to be able to provide. To me, being able to provide is part of being a man. If you go back to the tribal days, our evolutionary heritage, a man in a tribe that could not sustain himself, a hunter that could not kill enough to provide for his own, he would be a detriment to the tribe. He would be worthless because he has to be fed by other people. Other people have to take care of him. The man is supposed to not only be able to hunt enough to provide for his own needs but also provide extra for the women and the children who are not hunting. Things haven't really changed from that.

Nicole: So, I have a question for you that might be hard for you to answer. If you think that a man providing everything is the right way, what advice would you give to women dealing with dating in a society where it is mostly men who want to do 50/50?

John: Two things. One, be humble. The problem with demanding that a man pay for you without humility is that it comes across as taking advantage. However, you shouldn't have the expectation that he will pay for you, right? But you should have the standard that he will. It's a way of evaluating. You're giving the guy rope; let him hang himself. If a guy wants you and he's going to be a 50/50 guy, you're finding out a lot of information about him. A good guy, the kind of guy that's masculine that you want to be in a relationship with, he's going to insist on paying for you and he's going to do it in a discreet way. I always tell guys, all you have to do is this: when the bill comes, you're having your conversation, the waiter drops the bill on the table, you just casually pull out your wallet, take your credit card, while you're still having a conversation, just slip it in there and push it to the side. That's it. You're not making a big deal of it. You're not trying to bargain or make any transaction. It's just because you're the gentleman. In fact, most of the time the guy is inviting the woman out for a date. If I were to invite a friend out to dinner, I would automatically be paying for it because I'm inviting someone out. That's just basic courtesy. That's just being a gentleman. So, I would say to a woman, don't have the expectation, don't get all upset, don't even bring up the subject of it. Be willing to pay and then see what the man does because it's a great test. You can see what he's made of by that, how his mom raised him, what kind of values he has. If he's going to be like, "Okay, well, you had this drink and I had this drink, so here we go, let's split the check," that's not the guy.

Nicole: I agree, but at the same time, I feel like as a woman who was dating before you came along, it's hard to wait for the right guy because it is. I wasn't necessarily looking for somebody to pay for everything for me. I was happy with some dynamic that didn't feel like keeping score because keeping score in general is just not good with anything. It's still a little hard for women to find someone who wants to provide for you. Like I said, you can still find somebody that maybe can't pay for everything that you want and all your bills and those things but still can provide for you where you feel more appreciated and provided for than someone who's so heavily 50/50. The person who's so heavily 50/50, because this will kind of transition us into the next part of it, like we would make dinner at either person's house and say it was at his house, he'd be like, "So what are you making next time?" We can't even enjoy this experience without you being like, "Okay, so what are you going to do next?" Like 50/50 can also be like an emotional or other sort of relationship type of thing where there's still tabs being kept and there's still this not fully coming together. It's almost like a roommate situation or, like I said, more of like friends or companions when everything's still pretty separated, including the connection. I think that is what is the most detrimental of the 50/50, honestly, is that it can turn into such a transactional thing in all the ways, not just financially, but in emotions and what you're giving. Like, "I'm not going to give this because he didn't take out the trash," so I'm going to act like this. That sort of dynamic, I feel like you do see more with the 50/50 split.

John: Yeah, I agree 100%. In fact, we were just having this conversation this morning about that in terms of emotion. Guys complain to me all the time. They're like, "It's not fair. Why does a woman get to vent all of her problems onto me but I can't onto her?" Which seems logical, like it should be equal in that way, but it's not and it shouldn't be because as the man, you have a set of responsibilities that a woman does not. A woman needs to vent. Women are more emotional and they need to vent. A man needs to be able to listen to that and not get defensive, not take it personally, and be empathetic towards that and validate her emotions, validate her feelings, and let her get it out of her system. She needs that expression, she needs the shoulder to cry on. A man that does that is viewed as complaining, rightly so, or as weak because he's trying to get the support. The man is supposed to be the support. He's supposed to be the rock, the logical, dependable, stable person who's analytical and creates stability. Emotion is not stable, unfortunately, which is again, it's not bad.

John: It's not that women are bad because they have emotions; it's just that it's a different role. If the man is all emotional, it's not going to create a very safe dynamic. What can you depend on? A good example that I always use is, let's say, using the captain of the ship analogy. If things are going wrong on the ship and the crew kind of freaks out a little bit, like, "Oh my God, there's a storm, what are we going to do?" and the captain's like, "Oh my God, I don't know what we're going to do," how much confidence are you going to have in the captain? The captain, inside, might be like, "Oh, this is some scary stuff going on here," but he's going to present as, "I got this handled. I can take care of this, don't worry." He's calming down the crew and saying, "Don't freak out." If the captain starts freaking out with everyone else, who's going to really steer the ship, and who are you going to trust? So, that's why it can't even be 50/50 like that. It just doesn't work that way.

Nicole: But what about the captain suppressing his emotions and then causing problems? Like, how do you balance that out? I mean, I know how we do it, and like, you do come talk to me when you get to a point where you feel like you need some emotional support or guidance because women are more emotional, and so I understand that. But I think it's important to not portray it as, even if you're freaking out, just shove it down because a lot of men have problems with shoving things down, and then it kind of blows up. Which is understandable because that happens to women too; it just happens quicker because we have a lot of emotions, or it happens more often because we have a lot of emotions. But I think it's important to talk about that dynamic of it.

John: Well, number one, men need to be stoic, which doesn't mean not having emotions. It means not allowing your emotions to dictate your actions. That's what it means. It means to not allow the external to influence the internal. The ultimate goal of stoic philosophy, of being stoic, is tranquility, which means inner peace, which means that the external does not disturb your internal. It's very hard to do, but you should strive as a man to practice to become that. It's good for women to practice that as well, but it's way more necessary for a man to be that, right? Because he has to be that captain of the ship that's not going to freak out when there's a storm. The second thing is that there are three ways to handle emotions. One of them is to suppress them, one is to express them, and the third one is to process them. If you, as a man, express all your emotions all the time, that's not good, especially bad emotions like anger, sadness, uncertainty, envy. Just expressing those things out freely is not a good plan. It's going to cause a lot of chaos. Then, if you don't express it, what do you do? A lot of people think the only alternative is to repress it. Repressing it is like you're trying to block the expressing. It's like the water is coming towards you, the river is flowing towards you, and you're just absorbing all the water. It's just coming into you, and you're just absorbing it, right? And it's just like you're eventually going to blow up because you're going to fill up with water. That's what repressing is. It's not actually feeling the emotions in the moment; it's just ignoring them, what you're feeling. It's not being aware. Processing them is letting the river flow through you. So, you're still feeling them; you're just not expressing them outward, you're not pushing them down, you're letting the river flow through you and processing, letting go.

Nicole: Okay, so I think, I mean, I struggle with this, and I know a lot of modern women, I'm sure, do as well, because it's kind of confusing. So what you said, you know, you don't want men to be spilling everything onto each other, right? So it's hard for women to feel like they can open up all the time because they feel like they're spilling out onto everybody, and that that'll push men away. And it does, to some men. Like, some men don't want to deal with it. And so, women do learn that they need to figure things out on their own and things like that. So, like, can you explain that part? Because, like I said, I struggle with this for certain reasons, and I'm trying to work on that. But I think a lot of women need to hear why it's okay for them to express their emotions and why it's not okay for men to do it in a way that women would do it.

John: I think it's two things, right? So one of them is that it's how the emotions are expressed. A lot of women get that wrong. There's light female feminine energy and there's dark feminine energy. And expressing emotions as a woman, like the feminine of expressing emotions or living in the moment, and there's nothing wrong with that. However, when you're screaming at someone, yelling at someone, expressing, dumping the emotions onto someone as opposed to expressing them, like if you're truly, "I want to express my emotions. This is what I'm feeling. I'm really sad right now. I'm feeling anger. This thing is irritating me," if it's not directed at me, that's fine. It's not disrespectful. Once you cross the line of being disrespectful, then that becomes a not healthy way to express the emotions. So I think a lot of women think, "Oh well, I can just say whatever I want, or I'm just angry so I said that because I was angry, and so I can just curse or whatever." I was just mad. Like, that's, you're saying, can't be mad. It's like, yeah, I'm not saying you can't be mad. What I'm saying is you can't be like calling me names because you're mad or yelling in my face or doing inappropriate things.

Nicole: I agree with that. I was more so saying like the emotional weight of it and putting it on a man and how, like, that, to women, feels overwhelming. And I know we're different, but like I said, some people feel like it pushes their partner away, which is really, like, I'm assuming a man not being able to handle the woman's emotions in that way, and maybe the woman is handling them in the wrong way. I'm not saying that that's not the case, but I feel like it has been stressed more, like these days, that women, you know, figure their own stuff out.

John: Out and don't dump it on guys because guys complain about it. And same with the 50/50 thing; it's been so stressed by guys that it is perpetuating women to live this way. Not that I think all women want a man to just pay for everything so they don't have to do anything. There are some women out there who abuse those sorts of things, and those are easy to identify. But I think women have given up on having a more traditional relationship where the guy provides because it's just very rare, and it is hard in today's economy. You know, with inflation and everything, cost so much money, people can't even afford houses. So, I understand that even that pushes people into needing two incomes to afford things. But at the same time, I do think when it's an extreme, you can't have the same amount of intimacy. Going back to intimacy, it's so important because you're kind of living separate lives together rather than one. You have to become one. I do trust you, but I have to trust you, right? Because you're providing our life. If you don't get your work done, we might be eating ramen. Not that that is happening, or I don't think that would happen, but it does make you have a deeper trust in your partner.

Nicole: Exactly, yes. Than if you know you guys are just kind of fending for yourselves but living under the same roof. In which case, why even have the relationship, right? Because you're not creating a dependency on each other, even though that's the dangerous word. But it's well because codependency is bad, but interdependency is not. And to address the second point you said about women being told not to dump this on a man, unfortunately, a lot of the stuff that they have to say is that men need to man up. There's not a lot a woman can do about that, but men need to understand that women do need to vent. This is something I had to learn. In fact, I think the first time I learned it honestly was when I went to a Tony Robbins seminar, and he talked about this. Just sit there and listen. And then, here's good news for men to notice. When you do this, when you just allow a woman to vent and let her get her stuff out, and you validate her emotions, she is going to be walking on cloud nine. She's going to just love it. Like, "Oh, I know you're getting some action tonight, buddy," because I've been in your comment section. Guys are like, "My wife's so mad at me." I'm like, "Did you just give her a hug?" They don't think of that kind of stuff. She will appreciate it to an immense degree. Don't get emotionally involved in it, don't try to fix it, just allow her to express those emotions. It's hard to do, believe me, I know it. I screw up sometimes, but we're human.

John: But that's what men need to really learn. It's two things. One is, you talked about being one. So, if you're thinking about me versus her, which is just a bad way to transact. That's why I'm so against 50/50, by the way, too, because if you think of it as one, you're one organism, one entity. Then one side of you is emotional, and one side of you is more logical, and you need to allow the emotional side to get what it needs. And then, the other side of it is this. A man might be something that is very heavy for you as a woman experiencing more emotion. When you give that burden to me as a man, it's much lighter for me because those heavy emotions don't disturb me as much. So, you can release that to me. Sure, maybe it takes a little bit of an energy drain on me, but not as much as it's taking on you. Then what happens when you release that energy, and you have now all this energy freed up? Now you can use that energy to support me as a man, increasing my confidence, taking care of sexual needs, things that are going to make a man feel like he's on top of the world. Now he's going to go out and conquer the world, have more energy. It creates a synergistic effect. If we handle our problems by ourselves, it's one and one. But if you give me the things that harm you and I can deal with those easier, then you're free to be able to now support me in a way that I can't support myself energetically. Then 1 plus 1 becomes 3 or 4. That's really what the value of it is. And that's why 50/50 is literally 50 plus 50 together; it's 100, it's one. But when you don't play 50/50, you can have bigger than one. But you can never have bigger than one with 50/50.

Nicole: I agree. Something that I want to talk about for a minute is that realistically, I don't think a lot of people right now can do where they provide everything for everybody. So, I want to talk about ways that you can still have that closer amount if you are doing 50/50 right now and you want to make your relationship better. What still blows my mind is people who are married, okay, married people, who have separate bank accounts. I'm with you. Do you trust your partner? That just to me is like a huge red flag. You don't trust each other. There needs to be a joint account, and you need to put money in there together and pay the.

John: Bills should be managed together, right? As soon as you start splitting expenses, it becomes a matter of keeping tabs on each other. It's better to pool your resources. Maybe take out some money for personal expenses, like gifts, but there should be a joint account. Even if you're just dating but living together, you can create a combined fund.

Nicole: Exactly, and then pay from that fund because it makes you feel like a united front. It's weird to me when I see couples on Venmo, exchanging money for small things like coffee. People might get upset at us for saying this, but it's true. Put the coffee money in your joint bank account, and then it's not so transactional. Keeping everything transactional can drive you apart instead of bringing you together.

John: Right, I wanted to bring that up because even if you have to split expenses 50/50, there are ways to do it from a more united front. If you can't have a joint bank account with the person you're with, you need to reconsider. If you're in a committed relationship but don't trust them with shared finances, that's a big deal. It's almost a reason to break up.

Nicole: I agree. You shouldn't be with someone you don't trust, especially with financial decisions. It comes down to trust. If you're keeping things 50/50 because you're afraid of being taken advantage of, that's a problem. Men might be afraid of this because they don't vet their dates properly. But if you're a high-value person, you shouldn't worry about spending a bit on a date. A woman who values you for more than a dinner won't take advantage of you.

John: I know I'm an idealist. I believe a man should provide and take care of everything. However, I understand that's idealistic. Men should strive to be the best they can be. If you're already in a relationship and both need to work, you should aim for the ideal as much as possible. I've coached clients on building businesses so their wives don't have to work. Practically, this means pooling all money into an account and having the man be responsible for it. But sometimes, the woman is more financially responsible. If you're with someone you don't trust financially, they're not the right person for you.

Nicole: Right, because if your partner is irresponsible with money, that's a significant issue. Men say the same about women who might overspend. But it's about trust and responsibility, regardless of who handles the finances.

John: No, I trust you 100%. If you want to buy something, buy something. I know who you are as a person. I know that you're not going to run up the bill because I'm looking at it like this is our life, like one. I still do the same things that I would do if I was on my own, and I was a very financially responsible person and a responsible person in general. So, like, if you know I'm not just going to go buy like a new designer handbag just to do it because that just doesn't make sense to me. It's like if we have a discussion or whatever, and we come to that together, or there's some reason I need this thing, or I want to treat myself because I haven't in a while, that's different. But I would never just go and spend, which I do feel like some women might do that if they're in this sort of situation, if they're not using their own knowledge or maybe they don't have the knowledge because their parents supported her until she was however old, and she didn't really have enough time to do things on her own.

Nicole: Separate note, but I do think women need to learn to be on their own because I think it instills in them things that they need to learn.

John: I agree, but at the same time, you also have to find the right person to trust to let some of that go, but you still use the knowledge. Like you just said, I don't go on a shopping spree every day, and that's the difference. I treat it like I would treat it as my own money because it's our money. I'm not taking advantage of it like, "Oh, this is his money, so I'm going to buy whatever I want." You have to look at it as one. That's the whole thing, and that's why the people who aren't where we're at, where you're talking about, they can still get that oneness, and they need the oneness because otherwise, what are you doing? If you're in a relationship, you should be operating as one, as a team, exactly, 100%.

Nicole: And here's another thing because I think this is relevant to it, which is, what is the number one cause of arguments in a relationship? That is, it's number one. So that's why this is so important, and that's why I'm so adamant about not the 50/50 because if it's not 50/50, if the man's providing for everything, is doing, is paying for all the things, there's no argument. I mean, there's very little argument because it's, I mean, you could argue about, "Oh, she's spending too much money," or whatever, "He's not being financially responsible," but that's the amount of the argument that you could. But you can still even have a conversation about that, be like, "Hey, this is where we're at right now. You know that might affect some if you go out and purchase something. Just keep that in mind that this is what we're looking at right now." But that can also change. There should still be those conversations, and we even still have those conversations because again, it's like even though you're running it financially, we're still working together, exactly, if that makes sense. And you might have a budget, and you can have a budget, and you can form a budget together, and those type of things.

John: The other thing I was going to say about the 50/50, I just lost it now. There was something else, but I can't remember what it was now, so maybe it'll come to me. But I'm sure like we'll have other episodes that little tidbits of different things will go in because there's so many different topics. But yeah, I don't want to discourage people because that's not where people are operating from. But at the same time, it's like I do feel like as a woman, it's hard because you feel like all these guys are 50/50, and they're so strict about it, or so to a tee that you have to follow their lead, really, or you leave. And the thing is, you date, and you run into more guys that are like that, so then you start being like, "This is the reality of the world we live in now, and so I have to get used to it." And so that's why I really wanted to dive more into this because there's different reasons for all of it. Like, yeah, there are some people, like I said, that have to have two incomes to pay for stuff. People can't even afford houses and stuff these days. I know that you're going to say, "Work harder," but or live on, live less on, you know, you don't have to have the iPhone and the car, and you know what I mean. It'd be better to live a more humble means and have a better family, you know what I mean. I know it's hard. I know it is hard, but it's like people also didn't learn their priorities and their responsibilities either. That's a whole another. It is expensive now. I'm not trying to deny it. I know it is, but I also know that having come from nothing and made my own way in the world, that it is possible to do that, and that a man should be focused on.

Nicole: Oh, I know the other thing I was going to say was this is the one that women complain about, and rightly so, is because 50/50 guys, alright, they want to do the money 50/50 and the woman working, right, and then be in charge. But they don't want to do the chores 50/50.

John: Oh yeah, right. And women rightly complain about this. So the thing is, look, if a guy is going to have the woman work, like you said, sometimes they need to because it's expensive, right, then you kind of have to be 50/50 on the chores. If they don't have 50/50 everywhere else, like if you want to go 50/50, it's got to be 50/50, and a lot of men don't do that. They want 50/50, and then they want to still be the man and in charge and not have to do the things and not have to pull their weight in other ways. That's also a problem because besides just denying the guy, women, it's so hard for women to find a nice guy that eventually some woman will stay with this guy even though she's not happy, so he thinks it's right, and so he continues living this way. Women are going on all these dates, seeing all these things, and they're like, "Okay, this just must be how it is." Yeah, because it is rare to find the sort of dynamic that we have, and that you say is the ideal. It's really hard, but I think you can do it in certain ways that make it.

John: More unified, even if you have to be like 50/50 or whatever, but that's why women have to not accept 50/50. They have to have a high enough standard for themselves to say, "Look, no, I'm not going to settle."

Nicole: I get what you're saying, but people are afraid to be alone, and that's also another problem. They're afraid to be alone, and rightfully so, because there are people who talk about women's age and how their value diminishes after they get a certain age. But at the same time, they're not supposed to settle, so it's very complicated. I know I wasn't going to settle, otherwise you end up in this situation. It doesn't mean that a man has to be absolutely perfect. Maybe a guy might be misinformed and believe in the 50/50 system. It could work, but it just makes it harder to have the masculine and feminine dynamic in the relationship.

John: Exactly. Even in the situation where both are still there, like a woman still has to be masculine to pay her side of the bills, to make sure she's got stuff on time. It's harder for her to completely let that down. What happens if you're both working 9 to 5 jobs? Then how do you have the woman be the nurturer that's primarily taking care of the kids and the household? You can't, because that's really not fair at that point. What is the guy actually doing then? In a situation where the man is the one working and providing for all the bills and everything, then it is right to assume that the woman will take care of the household, the laundry, and the kids. Not that the guy shouldn't also be involved in the discipline of the kids and in the family, but she'd be the primary nurturer or the person taking care of the household. It has a negative connotation, but it really shouldn't be because it just makes sense. It's just really hard to have a masculine feminine dynamic if both people are working and the money's divided up in that way.

Nicole: Right, it becomes more like there's still the masculine aspect of the man being the more stoic, the stable, and analytical, and the women being the intuitive power of now, the feeling, and the emotion side of things. Her being more in her masculine does cause them to butt heads more at times because she feels like they're on the same playing field because they are at 50/50. It's almost like two leaders trying to lead, which is difficult. A woman goes to work and she has to be in her masculine in the workplace because it's a masculine environment, and then she comes home and now she has to try and switch over to the feminine, which is tough. A lot of women struggle with that.

John: It is a tough thing. I wish I had a solution for everyone because I know people are upset. They're like, "It's just not going to work; that's impractical." I think we gave a good solution, but you have to work at least you can try to be as close to move things in that direction as possible and to set up an ideal. If you are single, then you can say, "No, this is how I want my future relationship to work." If you're a man, you can say, "I'm going to build up my ability and finances and make sure that I can provide for a woman and a family before I look into a serious relationship," which I usually advise that guys wait until they're in their 30s to get into a serious relationship anyway. And if you're a woman, you can say, "Look, no, I'm not going to just lower my standards. I'm going to say, 'Hey, if I'm valuable enough that if a man wants me, then he should want to provide for me and take care of me.' And if he's not going to be able to do that, then I'm going to hold that standard there."

Nicole: I agree. So, I think we covered it. I think we did a good amount on that topic. It was hard because I knew that you were going to say what the ideal was, but at the same time, I do think it's important to try to help people that maybe aren't there yet or can't be there right now. People who are still dating and really want a certain type of dynamic. The key to a lot of things that we'll be talking about on this entire podcast is the intimacy, the trust, and the oneness. You don't have this separation when you feel like you're working as a team, as a unit, which is what a relationship and marriage ultimately is. It's the core foundation of it, and it's kind of gotten into different... I mean, I guess technically it used to be like a business transaction way back in the day, but it's kind of getting more back to that, if that makes sense, in a different way.

John: Exactly. So, I think it needs to go back to what everybody wants, what men want, what women want, and that's love, that's a partner.

Nicole: Exactly. Oh, I forgot. I always forget what I'm going to say. I was going to say something about... I can't think of it now.

John: That's okay. I need like a notepad to write down my notes. But no, I think we covered it good.

Nicole: Yeah, so you want to do our...

John: Right, so this segment is about something in our relationship that happened this week. Actually, it happened last night. We got into a little bit of a conflict.

Nicole: Yeah.

John: What happened, and I'll take responsibility for this, is that we went out to a restaurant to eat, and Nicole was having a little bit of a panic attack because her neck was still hurting.

Nicole: Yeah.

John: And in the car, I kind of tried to touch her neck to help her, and she kind of jerked away. You jerked away from it, and I got a little offended by that. Then in the restaurant, when you were upset about it, I wasn't paying more attention to what I perceived as you being upset.

John: Being rude because you were in your world of the panic of the right, and so I was like, "Oh, you know, you're being rude to me," and whatnot. I think what it ended up coming down to when we talked about it in the car was, one thing was that, yes, I was being less considerate. I was becoming more reactive, but there was something deeper that was bothering me, which we identified, which was that I felt like you never really asked me for help. It was good timing because I felt, as a man, not that you don't trust my leadership and all those things, but there's never really been a time that you've actually been like, "Can you help me with this?" aside from physical things, but like emotionally, "Can you help me?" Maybe if you want to talk about that a little bit.

Nicole: Like in that moment, I was just freaking out. If you've had a panic attack, it totally consumes you. I wasn't really paying attention to the things I said to him. They weren't really bad, but I was trying to calm myself down with the tactics that have helped me. In that moment, I just still, we were at dinner at one of those Brazilian steakhouses, so there's constantly people coming up, and it kept overwhelming me. It wasn't having a panic attack because of social anxiety. Like John said, I'm a huge hypochondriac, so anytime something hurts on me for a long period of time, I'm like, "I am dying." And then, if you know what a panic attack feels like, your body starts changing, and then you really feel like you're dying. All these things were happening. I was like, "I feel like I'm going to throw up on this table. I feel like I'm going to pass out." I was panicking, and I could tell that John was feeling a certain type of way, but in that moment, I was just like, "I can't stop and be like, 'Are you okay? What's going on with you?'" I was just trying to not pass out. I just really wanted you to reach out to me for help. I think that's why I was really emotional support, just like, "Help me." I've never asked anyone really for help because I grew up figuring my own problems out. My parents were busy. They worked all the time. It made me feel like a burden and being a woman, putting all your stuff on somebody, you feel like you're weighing someone else down. I didn't want to do that to you. You do provide for our family, so I didn't want to add my problems on top of his. It wasn't like I was doing it because I'm better and can figure it out, but you felt that way, and I don't want you to feel that way. It will help me by not having to completely do everything on my own and being able to lean on somebody. It's just learned behavior that I need to unlearn and reach out for help. It makes a man feel important and valued, honestly, especially in society today. Women are afraid of being seen as needy or not being able to handle things on their own. You sent me that TikTok, or a video on it, where it said about women being needy and that men do want women to be. It makes a man feel like he's useful. I really only heard it from him and you in that instance. It uncovered something that I needed to work on. I do need to reach out for you for help and other people too. There are plenty of people who are like, "Let me help you," and I'm just like, "Well, let me just do it myself because I don't want to put anything on them." It's hard getting out of that, but I do trust you, and I want you to feel that way, and I want you to feel like I need you, and I do need you. It was good to get to the root of that, even though I felt horrible and I still feel horrible that I ruined our date. We literally had to leave because it was pretty bad. I haven't had a panic attack like that in a long time, and I haven't had a panic attack at a restaurant before, so it was a whole experience. The money doesn't matter. This is the Better Than Perfect podcast, and the whole point is that it's through these things, it's not a perfect relationship all the time. There are things that come up, and that's what makes it better than perfect because we both grow through the experience. We do it in a healthy way where, even though there's some conflict, it's handled in a healthy way, and it produces growth after that. It's good to show the humanized side because so many people, especially on social media, present that their lives are perfect, and you never see the other parts. We're trying to show how the way that we mess up and make mistakes actually makes us stronger.

John: Exactly, real that people can do that.

John: Like, they're judgmental or might offend some people that we know, that even watch this. But we're not making any judgment on anybody else. We're just giving our true, honest truth, right? Without worrying about if it offends someone because that's what people have to figure their things out. They can figure, but it's not meant to be a judgment in saying that, "Oh, these people are bad or wrong because they're not doing it the way that we believe is correct." It's just, we're going to give our full truth, and we're not going to hold back because we're afraid of hurting someone's feelings. That's the truth. That's why I try to keep people's feelings in mind, but yeah.

Nicole: Yeah, I mean, you could do it in a nice, in a gentle way, but at the same time, you know, I know that some people are be offended by the 50/50 thing or what we talked about, you know, last week. But that's, you know. But I think we also acknowledge that, you know, everybody's at their own place and everybody wants certain things. And like, it's more about the root of what's going to make your relationship better rather than being 50/50 or not type of thing. Like, is there a more ideal thing? Sure, but is that achievable to everybody right now? No, like, that's the reality. So, I think it's important to give the actual tidbits of information that are going to help people get to where they want to be, right? Which most people want a really good relationship with the person that they're choosing to be with. So, and that's what this whole podcast is for. So, and that's why we have to show that we make mistakes, and we mess up, and we have conversations that help us get to a better place. Like, will we make some of the same mistakes again? I'm sure, but we both actively try to put what we talk about to action, like in action. And that makes a difference. So, awesome. All right, well, we'll see you guys next week.