John [00:00:00]: It is a game. We've talked about this multiple times.

Nicole [00:00:03]: People don't like that. But.

John [00:00:04]: But it is supposed to be a.

Nicole [00:00:06]: Game in a bad way. Like, you're lying to people. No, no, a dance. A dance is better because there's gonna be some chalance and there's gonna be some nonchalance.

John [00:00:16]: Yeah. But you have to play it as a game. Like, it's like, you gotta move your piece. You gotta be. You can't just be like, here's all my cards.

Nicole [00:00:24]: Yeah.

John [00:00:25]: And you can't go on a date and be like, look, I just have to be honest with you. I'm looking for a serious relationship, and I'm only dating for marriage right now. Like you could.

Nicole [00:00:37]: So you're my next husband, right?

John [00:00:39]: Beyond the perfect we discover through our flaws we complete each other. Better than perfect we stay through every.

Nicole [00:00:51]: Fault we find our way.

John [00:00:55]: All right, welcome back to the Better Than Perfect podcast, where every week we share with you how two imperfect people helping each other grow equals one better than perfect relationship. That was just a test.

Nicole [00:01:05]: I was like, did you do that on purpose? Because it sounded like it could have been on purpose, but maybe subconsciously.

John [00:01:14]: So I got your back, and that's what you're. Before we started. You're like, are you okay? And I'm like, don't forget your line. Don't forget your line.

Nicole [00:01:22]: Oh, well, look, I helped you out. I got your back.

John [00:01:26]: I jinxed myself into it.

Nicole [00:01:27]: That's very true. You ever thought it.

John [00:01:30]: Well, what do we. What do you got a list for us today? What are we. What are we talking about today?

Nicole [00:01:35]: We're talking about some new dating terms. And I don't want to say concepts, because the concepts probably aren't new, but the terms are new.

John [00:01:47]: But what are the. The cool kids talking about today? What's. Well, lingo.

Nicole [00:01:52]: I think we should first talk about terms from 2025, and then we'll talk about terms that they think are going to be applied to 2026.

John [00:02:00]: Oh, like the. It's like the terms before they are even trending.

Nicole [00:02:04]: Yes.

John [00:02:04]: Okay.

Nicole [00:02:04]: Yeah. Like the projected future.

John [00:02:06]: Yeah, it's just as long as 6, 7 is not on that list, then we're.

Nicole [00:02:10]: No, no, Nobody even knows that means.

John [00:02:13]: They six, seven to me.

Nicole [00:02:16]: Well, you're going to be my.

John [00:02:17]: Yeah, the.

Nicole [00:02:18]: My dictionary.

John [00:02:19]: Yeah. Okay, so what do we got? What's the first one? Let's talk about it.

Nicole [00:02:22]: We'll start with 2025.

John [00:02:25]: Okay.

Nicole [00:02:26]: There was something called shreking. I don't even know what that hold on.

John [00:02:30]: What is shreking? What do you think Shreking is? Or do you. Or did you look it up already?

Nicole [00:02:34]: I didn't look it up.

John [00:02:35]: Okay.

Nicole [00:02:36]: I think shreking is where they might not look the best on the outside, but you love them on the inside.

John [00:02:45]: That's. Yeah, it says.

Nicole [00:02:46]: Is that what it is?

John [00:02:47]: It says it's a recent Gen Z dating trend where someone dates a person they consider less attractive than themselves, hoping they'll be kinder, more appreciative and treat them better because they're dating down. But it often backfires, leading to heartbreak because the partner treats them poorly anyway.

Nicole [00:03:05]: Wow.

John [00:03:06]: It's a strategy born from dating fatigue. But experts warn its toxic self protective mindset that ignores genuine compatibility for perceived power dynamic. Oh, so it goes into the power dynamics.

Nicole [00:03:17]: Interesting. That's like very detailed. I didn't know shreking was so complicated.

John [00:03:23]: Yeah, I mean, there's a, there's a thing like in, in date that's existed for a while and that's not, it's not like the most best thing. So I'll try to describe in a way that's, that's not too, too much for this podcast, but where guys would say that, you know, if you date a girl that, let's say, has a little bit more weight on her, she'll be a little more eager to, to please because, you know, she's a little more rejected. So that, that has been the thing for.

Nicole [00:04:01]: But is that true?

John [00:04:04]: I think it can be true. It can be true, but it's not always. Yeah, it is kind of striking, but it's like it can.

Nicole [00:04:09]: No, it's definitely shreking.

John [00:04:11]: Yeah.

Nicole [00:04:11]: Because you're assuming that a woman that's maybe a little bit overweight or has more weight on her is going to do things to keep you no matter what you do, because she has more weight on her. That's definitely shreking.

John [00:04:26]: Yeah, that's definitely shreking. That's true.

Nicole [00:04:27]: That's like a woman dating an ugly guy being like, well, I'm hot and guys only care about hot girls, so I can do whatever I want because I'm hot. And he won't. He wants to keep a hot woman.

John [00:04:38]: Yeah, I guess it depends. I mean, the way it's been used in the past with guys is on a one night stand type of situation.

Nicole [00:04:45]: What are you getting? Besides the sexual part? That's all that matters. That's the part.

John [00:04:50]: I mean, she's eager to please is what they're saying. But the concept I mean, I think there's pros and cons to the concept of the shreking concept, because there's a good side to it, even though it's.

Nicole [00:05:03]: Which is that not judging a book by its cover?

John [00:05:06]: Well, yeah, if you find someone that. I mean, the power dynamic side of it is not obviously a good idea. But if you're thinking, all right, well, here's this person that maybe is overlooked because they're not conventionally attractive, but you find them to be attractive even though they're not the most conventionally attractive, or you find something about them that you like, then you might have a better partner because you might have someone who actually appreciates that they have someone that is attractive, who actually cares about them. You know what I'm saying? It can be a good thing to. I guess, because if you look at the opposite of it, some people, especially young people today, they're like, oh, I can't date this person because my friends think that he's ugly.

Nicole [00:05:55]: Or, well, we're going to get to that concept later.

John [00:06:01]: But the idea that it doesn't matter what other people think, if you actually like this person, then you are going to have compare it to the opposite situation where if you had someone who was extremely attractive and you date that person, they're more likely to cheat on you, you're more likely to. They're not. They're less likely to be satisfied in their relationship. That type of thing. Do you know what I mean?

Nicole [00:06:29]: Yeah.

John [00:06:32]: Are you distracted by this? You're worried you're gonna get, like, someone's gonna come up.

Nicole [00:06:37]: I'm gonna get stressed.

John [00:06:41]: There's the footsteps. Okay, no, but did you get. Did you get what I was saying? Or was your. Was your, like, life.

Nicole [00:06:48]: Survival instincts were blocked in. In your life? No, I know what you're saying, but. Cause I agree with you that there is something good about, like, not judging somebody too early and giving them a chance. And like, even if maybe initially you're not super, super attracted to somebody, but you're curious about them. I think it's a good thing to explore those sort of things. But obviously, like you said, too, the power dynamic of wanting to do this, though, is the huge problem. Like, if you're trying to date anybody for any reason, men or women or. And whatever that reason is, in order to use something like their looks or appearance or even their personality traits or something against them, that's just gross. Like, that's icky. That's manipulation. That's not good, obviously. But I think that, like, you Said too, being attracted to somebody that maybe your friends don't think is attractive, there's not a problem with that. I wouldn't call that shreking.

John [00:07:56]: Yeah, yeah, exactly, yeah.

Nicole [00:07:57]: Like, it's like everybody has different tastes.

John [00:08:00]: And it can blow up on you. Because if you like, like they're saying like if you, if you date someone because if you think, all right, if I date someone who is less attractive than me and now they're going to be more attached or they're going to whatever they're, they're going to like appreciate that, they're going to treat me better. That's what they were saying. Then what can happen though is that person can have low self esteem and then the fact that you're dating them can make them think, well, this person, if they actually want to be with me, there must be something wrong with them. Do you see what I'm saying? And so it can backfire in your face.

Nicole [00:08:36]: You're going way down.

John [00:08:37]: But it's, but it's down, but it's true. That's how.

Nicole [00:08:40]: I'm not saying it's not. I'm just saying that's like, it could work that way deep down in there.

John [00:08:45]: Where you're like, where you're thinking, oh, well, this person should be like very appreciative that they have someone like me who's so hot compared to them. And then they're like, what, why, what is wrong with this person? Like, you know, their self esteem is not making it like someone that has really low self esteem will always find a reason why things are wrong or bad. Right? You see what I'm saying? So they're not going to view it the same way. They're not going to say, oh, I'm so lucky to be with this hot person that's hotter than me that wants to date me and said they're going to say there must be something wrong with them because there's something wrong with me. Right. Which is going to potentially cause them to treat you poorly.

Nicole [00:09:29]: So I mean, makes sense. That's very complicated. So how would you combat against shreking? Just tell people not to. Like, if you feel like you want to date somebody so that they'll do whatever you want, you need to like stop yourself.

John [00:09:49]: Yeah, well, I mean, but you do have to take that into consideration, right? So for example, like what the difference in attractiveness, like, so when I, when I'm coaching guys, right, Some guys are like, oh, I want to get the hottest girl a 10 out of 10, like dolled up Right. High maintenance, like, sir, you're a four. Huh?

Nicole [00:10:10]: Sir, you're a four.

John [00:10:11]: Sure. But let's say that they aim for the czars. I'm like, okay, if you're four and you do somehow bag your 10, right. How is life going to be for you? Every time you go to outside or to the mall and every guy's looking at her and you're. And they're like, who's this Shrek? Why is she, why is he with this Shrek? Right? Like, how likely her DMs are gonna be filled with. It's like, do you want that? You know what I'm saying? If you're a confident guy and you can handle that, sure, that's fine. But my point is that there is a dynamic there. To understand that it's better in general to find someone who you like personality wise and who you're attracted to than to find the most hottest person that you can as your criteria or to try to find someone who's less attractive.

Nicole [00:11:05]: Like, you should make yourself feel better.

John [00:11:07]: Exactly. You shouldn't try to do either of those things. You should just find who you are compatible with and who you genuinely like. That's the best way. The other ways are not smart.

Nicole [00:11:18]: If Shreking was not about power and it was about, it doesn't matter what's on the outside, it's what's on the inside, then Shreking would be good. Because that is good.

John [00:11:27]: Everyone looks the same in the dark with the lights on.

Nicole [00:11:29]: Well, and like looks fade. Something could happen to somebody's looks. They could get into an accident. And so like, nobody should be basing their lifelong commitments on how somebody looks.

John [00:11:44]: Yeah.

Nicole [00:11:45]: Good or bad.

John [00:11:45]: And the newness will fade too. Like, and even if you thought like you had this perfect Shrek situation and you're like, you're dating down my Shrek in order to, after some period of time, that person that you're dating down to, you're like the new car. You're not the new car anymore. You might be just as good looking but they're not going to see that. They're not going to see the gap as much anymore because they're just used to you. Because you're in a relationship with them, you're not going to get that power dynamic that you had before. It's going to fade. Don't think that you're going to build a relationship based on wanting to have the power dynamic.

Nicole [00:12:19]: Yeah, we'll see. Here's another tough, complicated. We need to move on because we have so many. But one last thing on the Shreking is that women kind of like too when they date a guy. And, like, they can help them get hotter. I feel like women don't like, what, is there a movie discriminate, like, where they're like, oh, you know, this guy's not as attractive. They could be using it for the control thing, like you said with the Shreking.

John [00:12:46]: See the.

Nicole [00:12:46]: But they can. They want to also help their guy become hotter. So they'll be like, oh, well, why don't you wear this? Or like, let's maybe get your hair cut this way. I feel like women are more open to that. Where guys are not going to be like. I mean, normally they say the wrong things. They're like, maybe you should get a boob job. And it's like, okay, that's like way different than changing your shirt, sir.

John [00:13:07]: So it's like. But, but, but there is. There's there's a movie. What? There. I think there's movies on both sides of it, but there's some movie where some guy dates the homely girl and then she has a glow up. And what is that?

Nicole [00:13:19]: Is that like The Freddie Prinze Jr. One?

John [00:13:22]: Yeah, yeah, I think that's the one. But I think the opposite exists too. There's movies like that, but it's like finding the diamond in the rough. But that's smart. Like, to find the diamond in the rough. Right. If you're a girl. To find the guy that is a little bit nerdy, whatever. But you know that he's jacked or whatever underneath.

Nicole [00:13:41]: That's not what. You're missing the point.

John [00:13:45]: He just doesn't know how to dress.

Nicole [00:13:46]: You're like, he's nerdy, but he's jacked underneath. No, he's nerdy, but he's a good guy. And so she'll help.

John [00:13:52]: I was just bringing my childhood into my past. Childhood trauma, my teenage years.

Nicole [00:13:58]: Yeah, he's jacked deep down.

John [00:14:01]: Yeah. So maybe someday he'll be a podcast host like that, you know, so with his muscles out. But no, but what I'm saying is, is to find the diamond, like to see what other people don't see.

Nicole [00:14:15]: Yeah, we're saying the same thing. Except you're like, see the muscles underneath.

John [00:14:19]: He doesn't have a sense of fashion.

Nicole [00:14:22]: But help him out.

John [00:14:23]: Exactly. Or needs to get a haircut type of thing. But there's a cycle with women. So they'll date a guy maybe that isn't as conventionally attractive that they know they can glow up. And then they'll glow them up and then they'll be like, oh, actually, maybe you should have more brownies.

Nicole [00:14:42]: Not true, true, true.

John [00:14:44]: It is true.

Nicole [00:14:46]: That's only if the guy when women are first hot and then he's like, oh, I don't want you anymore. The woman that literally built him and then he's like, bye, I'm gonna go visit her model.

John [00:14:57]: I want to, like, project my boyfriend to make him hot, but not too hot. Hold on, buddy. We need to get a bit.

Nicole [00:15:03]: That's because guys get a little crazy when they get over inflated ego, so.

John [00:15:08]: Exactly. So all right. We should probably move on.

Nicole [00:15:10]: Yeah, we should.

John [00:15:11]: Term.

Nicole [00:15:11]: But okay.

John [00:15:12]: So shreking. Thumbs down.

Nicole [00:15:13]: Shreking like thumbs down if it was for the right reasons. Again, about what's on the inside. We're like Shrek said, we're onions. We have layers. If it's about uncovering all the layers of somebody, then yes, I can imagine based on what you said.

John [00:15:27]: No, but the fight where you're in the fight and then you're like, I Shreked you. You're like, what do you. What is that? They look up the term. They're like, that's fucked up. I can't believe that you dated. You thought you were dating down me, like, what? Because it's going to come up.

Nicole [00:15:43]: I don't think anybody would say that I Shrek you.

John [00:15:45]: I mean, they're going to like, say if they think that from the power dynamic and then it turns on them, they're going to definitely call it out and get themselves into trouble. So, yeah, don't ever tell someone you Shrek them.

Nicole [00:15:55]: So, okay, the next one for 2025 was monkey barring.

John [00:16:00]: Monkey barring.

Nicole [00:16:01]: Monkey barring.

John [00:16:02]: Okay. Monkey branching. Is that the same thing?

Nicole [00:16:06]: I don't know. Okay, what do you just said? Monkey barring.

John [00:16:08]: Do you know what it means?

Nicole [00:16:09]: Monkey barring is jumping from one person to the next.

John [00:16:14]: Okay. Monkey branching is that. But let's see what monkey barring is. Monkey barring or monkey branching. A toxic dating trend where someone finds a new romantic partner before ending their current relationship. Mirroring playground monkey bars, where you don't let go of one bar until you grip the necks, ensuring there's no single downtime.

Nicole [00:16:31]: Oh.

John [00:16:32]: Driven by fear of being alone, insecurity and convenience, often involving emotional cheating and betrayal. Unlike. Unlike ethical non monogamy, people who do this avoid the discomfort of being single and often have underlying attachment issues and abandonment wounds.

Nicole [00:16:49]: That makes sense because I didn't think about the Hanging on to one bar while you're going to the next bar. So that must be what it's about, like, emotionally cheating because you're still in that one relationship before you jump to the next one. Yeah, yeah, that's obviously not good.

John [00:17:04]: Yeah, that's not good. And also because you should try to have a buffer time in between two relationships to reflect on the previous one, have some personal growth and make sure you're not rebounding into another one. Right, right. Because. Yeah. So. And also it can cause an issue if you just even have that idea, that path open to you, then it's emotional allowing emotional cheating, which may cause you to basically break up with someone or end a relationship that you shouldn't have ended the relationship because you got involved with someone else and now you're like, oh, the grass is greener over here. So you should definitely not have any of your options open. And if you're like, okay, you're in a relationship that you want to end, you shouldn't be like, well, I'll just kind of hang out here until something better comes along.

Nicole [00:17:59]: Hang out on the monkey purse.

John [00:18:00]: Right.

Nicole [00:18:01]: No, I mean, I do think too, that it makes sense with the people that do kind of go from relationship. Relationship. And they don't ever have any down time.

John [00:18:12]: Yeah.

Nicole [00:18:13]: At all. Like, even for themselves. I think that does probably cause a lot of problems in the relationships when people jump back to back to back. Because again, I've said it on this podcast before, but I think it's important for everyone, at least some point in their life to have lived on their own and not been in a relationship. Because I do feel like the people that I've known that do jump from relationship to relationship, like, they only care about having somebody.

John [00:18:43]: Yeah.

Nicole [00:18:44]: And that. And they don't want to be alone. And that causes them to be with people that maybe aren't the best for them.

John [00:18:53]: And.

Nicole [00:18:54]: But they would rather choose not being alone than being with the wrong person. And I think that they have to face that. Being alone.

John [00:19:03]: Exactly. Yeah.

Nicole [00:19:04]: Part of them. In order to have the relationship that they want. I feel like they end up in relationship to relationship to relationship because they are lacking that alone time to understand themselves and like you said, their past relationship experiences. Because if you just jump to something new and you haven't really processed the last thing that you were in.

John [00:19:26]: Yeah.

Nicole [00:19:27]: You're probably not going to be applying those lessons that you learned to this new relationship because you didn't even take the time to, like, absorb.

John [00:19:35]: Right.

Nicole [00:19:35]: What just happened. And so that Makes a lot of sense though that the people that go from one relationship to the next, especially like they're transitioning while in some instill the old relationship to the new one, they just have to keep that momentum going because otherwise they feel like they're going to fall into this pit of despair or something. I guess because that's why they're afraid of being alone. And the pit of despair is the being alone.

John [00:20:00]: Exactly. Yeah.

Nicole [00:20:01]: But I think that when you view being alone as so negative that it keeps you from like being in like you have to be in any sort of type of relationship, it doesn't matter, you just need somebody there, then that's. You have to face that. Like you have to face.

John [00:20:17]: Yeah.

Nicole [00:20:18]: Yourself. Like it's kind of running from yourself.

John [00:20:21]: Yeah.

Nicole [00:20:21]: If you think about it, obviously we're humans. Nobody wants to like never have anybody. We do value each other as human beings and community and those sort of things. So that is in our natural instinct to want to be with people. So I'm not saying that that's not normal, but when you are monkey barring, that's not normal. Or when you're. You can't be alone at all, that's not normal. Because a lot of self reflection and learning and wisdom comes from those times when you're on your own. And I think, like I've said before too, that if you enjoy your time on your own, then you end up making better decisions when, when you do look for a partner because it's a higher level, higher standard that that person has to be at. Because you already had.

John [00:21:16]: You're already happy.

Nicole [00:21:17]: Yeah, yeah, exactly. You're already happy.

John [00:21:18]: So they become an asset, like an addition to your life. Not the, not the thing that brings you.

Nicole [00:21:23]: That you need.

John [00:21:24]: Yeah, yeah.

Nicole [00:21:25]: Like I'm not saying I don't need.

John [00:21:27]: You, but you know what I mean, you'd be happy. You could be happy on your own.

Nicole [00:21:31]: Right.

John [00:21:32]: So you're happier.

Nicole [00:21:34]: Exactly.

John [00:21:35]: As opposed to being in a needy situation where I can't be happy unless I'm with someone. Doesn't matter who they are now I'm happy. Or I can be happy now.

Nicole [00:21:47]: Yeah, exactly.

John [00:21:48]: Yeah. I think there's some intricacies to this as well. So the term the monkey barring, I think that was the more friendly term from the monkey branching, which was mostly applied to women in the kind of red pill space because this term has been around for a while. And I think the reason why it's disproportionately applied to women is because it happens more Women are more likely to monkey bar or monkey branch. And the reason being is two reasons, I would say. One of them is because they just have more of the ability to do it. Because when a woman is considering ending a relationship, she's got plenty of guys usually that have already been orbiting her and that she can reach out to. So it just happens quickly.

Nicole [00:22:28]: Yeah.

John [00:22:29]: But also when a man is considering ending a relationship, he cheats physically, whereas women cheat emotionally a lot of times because they don't necessarily view it as cheating. And so a woman will exit a relationship. Right. And then she'll instantly be with another guy. And then sometimes people say, oh, well, she was cheating. Or, you know, obviously the monkey branching thing. But it could be that it just so happens that when you're a single lady, it's very easy to find another guy. Right. If you want to.

Nicole [00:23:05]: Well, it's funny you said that, because all the people that come to my mind that I know monkey bar are men.

John [00:23:11]: Well, they were probably already cheating, though. Like, they didn't monkey bar or whatever. They probably just cheated and then. Which I guess you could say that's the same thing. It's monkey barring it is the same thing.

Nicole [00:23:23]: When you were actually explaining it and you were talking about the difference between how men and women do it, I feel like women are like, on the monkey bar and they're like reaching for the next one.

John [00:23:33]: Right.

Nicole [00:23:33]: Because it's emotional, so it like has to build up. Because men are just like. Yeah, exactly. They firmly grasp each side when you're intimate. That is a full hand grip on those monkey bars on both of them.

John [00:23:47]: That's true.

Nicole [00:23:48]: So that's true.

John [00:23:49]: Yeah.

Nicole [00:23:49]: Yeah. You're saying this, but, like, the people that came to mind talking about this that I know are men.

John [00:23:56]: Yeah.

Nicole [00:23:56]: But like, I'm not saying women don't at all.

John [00:23:58]: Yeah.

Nicole [00:23:58]: But the actual examples of this that I know in my real life are men doing men.

John [00:24:05]: Right. Because men are more likely to physically cheat. Right. Where. But the thing is that I think is important to understand is that women have to understand that emotionally cheating is still cheating.

Nicole [00:24:16]: Yeah.

John [00:24:16]: So you might think you're not monkey barring or monkey branching, but if you're in a relationship that you don't like, that you're thinking of getting out of, but then you're talking to a friend at work that's a guy or whatever it is, and you like him, and you're seeing what develops, or you have guys in your DMs, then you're cheating. That's cheating. Because it's emotional, even if there is not even a romantic element of it. If you like a person and you're talking to that person and they. And, you know, it could develop into something. It's this. It's the seed of the thing. So it's the same.

Nicole [00:24:49]: I mean, I agree. I'm not saying that that's not the case, but I'm not even strictly talking about cheating, because, I mean, my boyfriend that did cheat on me in high school, he, though the two relationships before him and I became in a relationship, though, was back to back. And even then he cheated on me, and then he got in another relationship immediately and then ended up marrying that person. So it's like his whole relationship history was back to back to back. So I don't know if he cheated on those other people before, but that's what I'm saying is that it's not really fair for men to act like this is a woman problem when men are equally, if not potentially more so likely to do this, because this is also why they're more. Potentially more so. And I say potentially because I don't know. But here's why. They are potentially more likely to do so.

John [00:25:49]: Okay.

Nicole [00:25:50]: Men will stay in relationships longer than they really want.

John [00:25:55]: Exactly.

Nicole [00:25:55]: And men are less likely to be okay on their own. They are more likely to need somebody there, no matter who that person is.

John [00:26:03]: That's true.

Nicole [00:26:04]: Than women are.

John [00:26:04]: Yeah. You don't have, like, you know, Cat. Old cat man.

Nicole [00:26:08]: Right, exactly.

John [00:26:09]: The woman with the cats is a thing.

Nicole [00:26:11]: Well. And all the men that are alone.

John [00:26:12]: Yeah.

Nicole [00:26:13]: If you ask them, hey, would you be with this woman if she wanted you to? He'd say yes. He doesn't need to know her. He just wants to be with someone.

John [00:26:20]: He would totally Shrek.

Nicole [00:26:22]: Right, exactly. So, like, yeah, I would say that men are more likely to. Monkey bar.

John [00:26:28]: Yeah, I see what you're. If they. Well, okay, so one more lens to this, which is men are more opportunistic in the sense that. Because there's. Again, we've talked about this before on the podcast, but there's essentially three sexes. Right. There's woman, man, and boy. And it doesn't even have to be it that way. But there's two categories of men. There's men who are the top 10, 20%, men who have the ability to get women. And there's the bottom 80% who are lucky if a woman will look their way. Right. You know what I'm saying? So when you think about it, like, okay, top 10, 20% of men are they likely to monkey branch and they have the opportunities, so they are more likely to take them. Whereas the bottom 80% of men, if they had the opportunity to, they would likely do it. But you don't see it because they don't have the opportunity. But it's like a guy like that that's in a relationship that he doesn't like, he's going to stay in that relationship because he doesn't have a lot of opportunities. But I guarantee you if some hot girl comes by and starts giving him attention, he's going to jump to that girl. Right? He's going to.

Nicole [00:27:43]: But even if he's not doing it while he's in it, he's going to be not okay being alone because he's still going to want somebody. So I don't know if that's technically still monkey barring, but I think even the people that maybe they aren't cheating emotionally or physically, but they in one relationship and then immediately get into another one, I would still call that monkey barring even if it's not actively happening in the relationship.

John [00:28:10]: Well, it's usually something happened. And that's the thing is like with women, usually what's happened when a woman, because women get accused of this a lot of times is they break up with a guy and then all of a sudden they're with a new guy. And usually what's happened was there was an overlap. It's not the overlap that guys where they're cheating physically, but there's emotional overlap. Usually that happened. It's like a lot of times women will say, well, I didn't cheat because I didn't have any relationships with this other guy. It was like, yeah, but you've been talking to him for three months. So that was cheating. Like it's an emotional cheating. So that's what happens in many cases. But. But I think also the other thing to think about as to why women get accused of it more is that like I said, it's just an opportunity thing. The top 20% of guys, they're going to be able to monkey bar as much as they want. Women in general can do it because they always have at least some guy that they could go that they could date at any time. It's very rare for a woman to not have options.

Nicole [00:29:10]: Yeah, but I think that men might be more likely to do it to.

John [00:29:15]: If they have the opportunity. I think if they have the opportunity. And like you said, I think the loneliness thing of men are less likely to be okay with, with being alone yeah, right. You know, especially if they've been in relationship.

Nicole [00:29:27]: Yeah.

John [00:29:28]: So.

Nicole [00:29:29]: Okay, I think we Monkey bard.

John [00:29:30]: Beat that.

Nicole [00:29:31]: We barring done. Is this chalance?

John [00:29:37]: You wrote it.

Nicole [00:29:38]: I know.

John [00:29:38]: Oh, like nonchalance. That's what I'm like, nonchalant.

Nicole [00:29:41]: So like, is that how you would.

John [00:29:43]: Let's.

Nicole [00:29:44]: That's what it. They said. But is that how you are perceived, Shalon?

John [00:29:49]: Yeah, let's see. What. What is.

Nicole [00:29:52]: Is that just like caring.

John [00:29:56]: Chalance?

Nicole [00:29:59]: That's what I would guess that would be. My guess is like nonchalance is like. Yeah, I don't care. Shalon is caring.

John [00:30:06]: What is shalon? In date? In dating, shalant is a popular slang, a back formed opposite of nonchalant, meaning to be enthusiastically invested, intentional and genuinely interested in a partner. Rather than playing it cool or being indifferent, a shalant person shows effort through consistent communication, remembering details and planning thoughtful dates, signaling they value connection and want to build something real. Moving away from the traditional game playing. Wow, that's a bad idea.

Nicole [00:30:37]: I feel like you can be nonchalant and Shalom.

John [00:30:39]: Yeah, exactly. That's a good idea. Nonchalant is a very bad idea.

Nicole [00:30:44]: You need to be nonchalant, but the non is in parentheses. Because like sometimes you need to be nonchalant, but sometimes you could be shalant.

John [00:30:50]: Yeah, it has to be a little bit of a back and forth.

Nicole [00:30:53]: Six, seven.

John [00:30:54]: Yeah.

Nicole [00:30:54]: No, I'm just kidding.

John [00:30:55]: No, no, no, no. Why?

Nicole [00:30:59]: He went like this.

John [00:31:01]: But. But yeah. I mean, if you're like, it is a game. We've talked about this multiple times.

Nicole [00:31:07]: People don't like that. But.

John [00:31:08]: But it is supposed to be not.

Nicole [00:31:10]: A game in a bad way. Like. Like you're lying to people. No, no, A dance. A dance is better because there's gonna be some chalons and there's gonna be some nonchalance.

John [00:31:20]: Yeah, but you have to play it as a game. Like, it's like you gotta move your piece. You gotta be. You can't just be like, here's all my cards. And you can't go on a date and be like, look, I just have to be honest with you. I'm looking for a serious relationship and I'm only dating for marriage right now.

Nicole [00:31:41]: So you're my next husband.

John [00:31:43]: Right. So let's talk about, do you want to have kids? Let's see if we're compatible before we even do anything else. That's a bad idea.

Nicole [00:31:52]: He says, as I asked him if he wanted kids.

John [00:31:55]: Or you go on a date and be like, I'm Gonna be totally honest with you, and I'm going to let you know if I'm attracted to you or not at the end of the date. Like, not a good plan. Like, you can't be that way because it is a game. You have to hide information. And.

Nicole [00:32:10]: And it's like, I don't like the word hide. I think it's like.

John [00:32:13]: You do, though. It is hide information.

Nicole [00:32:15]: I don't think it's hide. I think it's like, not really. I like to call trickle trickle. You have the information. It's not like you're withholding it, but you're, like, trickling it in. Because you don't even know if that person deserves to know if you want to have kids or not. Because, like you said, do you. You have to see if you even like this person first.

John [00:32:36]: Let me give you an analogy, because I'm good at that. Okay, so suppose you have a magician. You have a magician, right?

Nicole [00:32:44]: Yeah.

John [00:32:45]: And you're like, why don't you just show us how you do all the tricks? Like, it's not gonna be very entertaining magic show if he's like, all right. Oh, and let me show you how I did that. See, I hid this behind my hand. And that's like, there has to be the element of magic there. Right? So you can't. A magician has to hold. He's not holding back information because he's trying to deceive you and trick you, because he's doing it for your own entertainment, because you're not going to sit in that seat and watch the show and have a good time. If he just shows you how all the tricks are made or how all the tricks happen, it's the same thing, is you're keeping the interest by not giving too much away too fast, so that over time, you can actually be in proximity long enough. You have enough interest to see if you actually like each other. And then you start revealing more of the information.

Nicole [00:33:39]: Yeah, I agree. And at the same time, though, you can show chalance by having conversations with the person that you're on a date with and mentioning something that they talked about or that you noticed on their dating profile or that they're wearing or, I don't know, something that they brought up that shows Shalon while being nonchalant, if that makes sense. Like, in the beginning, you do have to be sort of nonchalant, because it is nonchalant. You have not gotten to know each other enough for the Shalons, but you can show some Chalons by. By, like, picking up on the things that they say, right? And remembering that, sure, yeah. But I wouldn't be like, wow, I'm so excited to be on a date with you right now. Like, this is just the best date and you guys haven't even got your it's like main course meal yet.

John [00:34:35]: This is how I would tell guys to act, right? So one, match a level of investment, right? Number two, like, be the gentleman that you are, but not specifically because of that woman. So be the guy, open the doors, pay for the date. Be that kind of gentleman that you are. That's impressive, but not because you're trying to win her over specifically, but because that's who you are. You see what I'm saying? So you're, in a way, you're being nonchalant, but you have chivalry, right? And it's just who you are. It's just your character traits, which is impressive as opposed to the opposite of that, which is you show up at the girl's house with flowers and you're trying to impress her. You're trying to show her how over the top you're going to because she's your fair maiden princess, that you don't even know her. You see what I'm saying? It's like if you're just a guy who is a guy who's a gentleman who takes care of the check, who acts, pulls out the chair, opens the doors, does those type of things, treats her respectfully, that just says who you are. And it's not being nonchalant where you're like, I don't even care. It's like, I'm a person who cares, but that's just how I am to everyone. And then if you're that special woman, then you get even more. Like, you'll get this. You'll get this treatment all the time, and you'll be in and you get more than that. You see what I'm saying? It's like, that's the way I don't.

Nicole [00:36:17]: Think you're should your chance. Or nonchalance should be based on anybody. Well, it's like, I'm not saying this. Like it shouldn't be based on anybody. Your nonchalance should not be based on per person. It should be based on this is the first date. I'm not going to tell all this information or like, I don't really know this person to an extent to tell them this stuff yet. Like, it should not be based on that person specifically. It should be based on where you're at in the dating Process.

John [00:36:45]: Well, which is. Which is the investment level, Right? Because it's going to go. Because things can go fast. But that means that in order for things to go fast, it has to be like this. This is the level of investment of both people. Right. The guy shows a little bit more investment, and then the woman shows a little bit more investment, and then more. And then more and more. It's like it has to stack like that. That could happen on the first date. It could go really fast and accelerate really fast, or it could be slow. The problem is when one person's like. You see what I'm saying? Then it's like, okay, now the thing is going to crash down, but it can stack very quickly. So that's why it's like some people can hit. Hit it off and know their soulmates on their first or second date, but it's both people.

Nicole [00:37:26]: You have to gauge it.

John [00:37:27]: Both people are putting higher levels investments, not one person just putting a high level of investment.

Nicole [00:37:33]: Right. So makes sense.

John [00:37:36]: All right.

Nicole [00:37:36]: Any other Shalons you want to talk about? I like.

John [00:37:39]: I like it. All right, what you got?

Nicole [00:37:42]: Now we're going to get into the 2026.

John [00:37:46]: Oh, this is not predictions.

Nicole [00:37:47]: No, those were the three 2025 ones. Well, the bad one is. Well, I mean, some of these can. I mean, all of these have been not the best, but. Flood lighting.

John [00:37:59]: Okay, so you already kind of know what this one is, right?

Nicole [00:38:01]: I do.

John [00:38:02]: Flood. Let me look it up, though. Flood lighting.

Nicole [00:38:06]: It's. But again, it's like good and bad. It's like taking a good thing and making it bad.

John [00:38:12]: Hold on. Oh, shoot. It's going AI on me. All right. Floodlighting in dating is a new trend where someone rapidly overshares deep personal information, trauma, past relationships, struggles very easily, very early on to create an intense instant bond. Appearing vulnerable, but often using it manipulatively to gain sympathy, control, or speed up intimacy rather than building a genuine connection slowly. It's like flashing a bright light. Bright lights to dazzle someone. Creating a false sense of closeness without real substance. And you feel overwhelming or strategic rather than authentic. I feel like. Does this actually work, though? I think a lot of.

Nicole [00:38:52]: I think only in, like, really traumatic experiences.

John [00:38:56]: Yeah.

Nicole [00:38:56]: That it would work, because there's not anything wrong with being vulnerable and talking about those things. I mean, obviously, too early on. Again, like we just said with the Shalons, you don't want to go on your first date and be like, both my parents died of cancer, and I'm all alone. You know what I mean, like, in the world.

John [00:39:17]: Yeah, I suppose. Yeah.

Nicole [00:39:18]: Like, even if that is your story, you don't want to just be telling that to somebody that you may or may not ever see again.

John [00:39:27]: Right.

Nicole [00:39:28]: And so they're saying, like, if someone's telling you that, and then you guys. And then maybe the other person's like, oh, I lost one of my parents, too. I couldn't imagine what you're going through. And then, like, now you're kind of trauma bonded, and then that first person will be like, you know, using that as a way to keep the person there. Like, if I don't have you, I have. Who do I have? You know what I mean? Like, that's the only way I can see it is, like, manipulating in that way.

John [00:39:57]: Yeah. It's so. It's. It's complicated because I feel like it wouldn't work for most guys if they come to a date and they're like, I lost both of my parents. And, like, women would be like, okay, right. Whereas I think if a woman came and said that, I think she could very easily manipulate a man.

Nicole [00:40:14]: I think you're wrong.

John [00:40:16]: Okay. How so?

Nicole [00:40:18]: Because, like, I think you're kind of going under the guise of, like, women don't care. Like, if that woman is interested in that guy enough to go on a date with him and then she finds out he's all alone. Like, women care more than men do, actually. Like, we watch movies and I'm like, the fake Avatar creature that isn't even real and it's totally CGI is dead. And that's so sad. Like, a woman's gonna be like, oh, that's like. That's horrible. Like, I want to be there for.

John [00:40:49]: Them, but doesn't it come across as weak and pathetic?

Nicole [00:40:53]: No, because they can't control that.

John [00:40:55]: No, but they. But yes, but they've revealed that information very early on.

Nicole [00:40:59]: No, I don't think that women view it that way. Men would. Yeah, women don't. Women view it as vulnerable and, like, open. And that's why they're saying that, okay, it can be used as manipulation because now they've shared all this stuff. And, like, a woman's been like, oh, I can't believe, like, you went through that.

John [00:41:18]: That's like, okay, if he's an attractive guy, but if he's not an attractive guy, then it will backfire. Right? So again, the 8020, right. Like, the 20% guy, he reveals both his parents died in a horrific car crash. Immediately she's like, oh, wow, I love this guy. Right. The bottom 80% guy that she gave a shot, not sure about this guy. And then he reveals that right away. Now he's creepy. I don't think that's or not necessarily creepy, but like, oh, I feel sorry, I feel pity for this guy as.

Nicole [00:41:52]: Opposed to, here's what I think happens. So men like to say women don't have empathy, but men say that in a long term relationship where a man has also made mistakes that has caused a woman to resent him. And so she is not giving him empathy at the very beginning. She's giving everyone empathy for the most part. Most women do. That's like in our nature. It's when things start hardening and resenting and all that stuff comes in that yes, women don't give men the empathy that men should have. So initially, I think what men might not understand is that a woman doesn't have any resentment for that man. She doesn't have any sort of preconceived notions or anything like that because this is the first few times meeting him. So when he opens up about something like both of his parents died and he doesn't have anybody, they're not viewing it as weak or bad. They're viewing it as if they heard a story of someone else. They don't know who, who went through something horrible and they're going to be like, oh my God, that's horrible.

John [00:43:00]: But does that really increase the chances of the, the guy that's in the bottom tier of men getting a second date or like that woman liking him? I can't.

Nicole [00:43:11]: I think I feel like it does if he does it in a way that's not like, oh, feel bad for me, but is actually like talking about his experience. Like maybe they were like, well, what are you doing for the holidays? And he's like, well, you know, I don't really have plans anymore. Both my parents passed away from cancer. And so it's really just me now, like the way he goes about it.

John [00:43:32]: So whether it's.

Nicole [00:43:33]: She's gonna be like, oh my God, he has nowhere to go on Christmas, like that's gonna be most women's normal response with a guy that she just met.

John [00:43:43]: So it's a matter of whether it's vulnerability or weakness. Right. Because like the true vulnerability comes from a place of, of of confidence. Right. Where it's like you're, you're sharing something about yourself, whereas the weakness is woe is me, pity me. Right?

Nicole [00:44:02]: Yeah. But most guys aren't putting it that way because they also don't Want to appear weak.

John [00:44:07]: Because I'm just thinking, like, if I'm, if I'm giving a guy dating advice, right, he's going on a date with a girl, I would never ever tell him to sell, tell some sad sob story that would make her or to be super vulnerable in that way on the first date. That's not going to get you laid. It's not going to get you a second date. That's not the plan. If she was really romantically interested in you and you're flirting with her and things are going well. And then if you wanted to strategically manipulate the situation by expressing some kind of deep vulnerability of something that happened in your past or whatever, or past relationship or trauma and. And then she, like now is even more bonded to you, sure, that would work. It wouldn't be a smart, it would be a manipulative tactic. But you would have to have already established a flirtatious, like, attraction level in order for that vulnerability to be meaningful. But if you just led with that, I would think that you're going to go, you're going to. That's a fast track to getting ghosted. You see what I'm saying?

Nicole [00:45:14]: Yeah, I think that, like, there are different aspects to this because I think that a majority of men actually, if a woman did that would not go.

John [00:45:29]: You think they.

Nicole [00:45:30]: With a woman that said something like, if a woman floodlighted, I think most men actually would not date that woman again. Especially because the 80% you're talking about also probably watch a lot of red pill stuff and things like that, and they would assume that something's wrong with her and that she has problems. But I think that a woman initially would give men more of a chance if he said something like that. Like, I'm not saying that women can't floodlight and that it's just men. But I think like I said, women by nature are empathetic no matter what guys like to say. Like, I explained why they seem not as empathetic later on. But I think they're more prone to be like, if a guy came and again, he wasn't like, oh, I have the worst life ever. Because no one is going to want to be like, even a man's not going to be with a woman that's like, oh, I'm like, just no one's ever going to want to be with me or whatever. Like, they're not going to date her either. But I do feel like women in that situation would be like, oh my God, he has nobody. Like, you know, I'll go on some more dates with him. Maybe this will, you know, I don't want to. He doesn't have anybody. Maybe I'll, you know, spend more time with him or something like that. Whereas, like, I think men would view it as like, oh, she lost both of her parents. She has. Obviously has daddy issues or something. Or like, there's definitely probably some hoe behavior or whatever they like to, like, come up with.

John [00:46:59]: Yeah.

Nicole [00:46:59]: I think that men are more likely to go down that path and women are more likely in the beginning, like, if this is used in the beginning. And women are more likely to, you know, feel the pain of that person and want to, like, give them the thing that they don't have.

John [00:47:16]: I mean, it's. I guess. I mean, it's a tactic. Right. That guys have used for. Forever. Right. In order to get into a woman's pants. Right.

Nicole [00:47:25]: So you're just approving. What I just said is that it does seem more likely that men are going to use this.

John [00:47:31]: I think that's if it's. I think if it's executed correctly. Correctly. Right. So it's like. Because trying to get someone to feel sorry for you is a bad tactic. That's not gonna work. Right.

Nicole [00:47:44]: Yeah.

John [00:47:45]: But strategically revealing a vulnerability that is going to get them, like, bond them to you is a different thing. Or like a guy pretending to be more in love with a girl in order to get into her pants. This is kind of the similar love bombing.

Nicole [00:48:02]: Yeah, similar to that. But now using like a traumatic.

John [00:48:06]: Yeah, I think. I mean, overall, this is.

Nicole [00:48:08]: Which is wild.

John [00:48:09]: Like this.

Nicole [00:48:10]: Don't use your trauma to manipulate people.

John [00:48:12]: What is this thing called again?

Nicole [00:48:13]: Floodlighting.

John [00:48:14]: Floodlight. Yeah. It's a bad idea because it's probably. I think it's bad. Unless you're the master manipulator, you're probably gonna pull it off wrong. Right.

Nicole [00:48:23]: Yeah.

John [00:48:23]: That's what I'm saying. It's like, I can't imagine any guy that I know that I'm coaching that would pull this off correctly. I feel like it would backfire on them big time. Because it's like, oh, I revealed all this vulnerability and then she never wants to talk to me again. Yeah. Because you came across as a loser is what ended up happening is.

Nicole [00:48:42]: You know, I'm saying it's essentially trauma bonding.

John [00:48:44]: Yeah.

Nicole [00:48:45]: Early on.

John [00:48:46]: But you have to have something in order to. Trauma. Like, you have to have enough of a connection already in order for this to work. It's not going to create it.

Nicole [00:48:52]: Well, then maybe the person floodlighting hears the other person brings something up and then is like, oh, yeah, I have nobody. And then, then they feel trauma bonded. Like may the person floodlighting is going off of whatever the other person said that might have been traumatic. And then they're trying to be like, oh, I also went through this traumatic thing and now you're trauma binding.

John [00:49:14]: I mean, it's either going to spectacularly fail or you're going to be the master manipulator and you should definitely not do this. So it's either one of those.

Nicole [00:49:22]: I mean, I don't think you should do it.

John [00:49:24]: Yeah, that's what I'm saying. It's like. That's what I'm saying is like, either way, you shouldn't do it because you're either going to fail at it horribly bad or it's very devious to do so. Either way, it's not good.

Nicole [00:49:34]: No. Yeah. So, okay, moving on to the next one because we still got like four.

John [00:49:39]: Oh, four. Okay.

Nicole [00:49:41]: Clear coding.

John [00:49:42]: Oh, okay. Do you know what this one is or kind of.

Nicole [00:49:46]: Yeah, I do. Do you want me to say what it is? My, like.

John [00:49:50]: Yeah, give your.

Nicole [00:49:51]: My little definition. Is that it's like being transparent about what you want.

John [00:50:00]: Oh, okay. So it came up with Winter coating is a dating seasonal trend where someone rekindles old flame or X.

Nicole [00:50:14]: Winter coating.

John [00:50:15]: Yeah, I was trying to get that.

Nicole [00:50:20]: That's because it's cuffing season.

John [00:50:28]: Okay. This is a challenging, challenging episode for the. But the viewers won't know that we have a tremendous amount of noise above us and around like people sneezing. All right. In relationships, the term clear coding is not a standard psychological term, but appears to be a metaphor for transparency and clearing resentments. It suggests removing obstacles to authentic communicate connection and ensuring no underlying issues accumulate or remain hidden. Transparency and honesty, Vulnerability, Conflict resolution. Clear communication, authenticity. Okay, so. So I think that's.

Nicole [00:51:09]: So it's just being transparent.

John [00:51:11]: It seems like that's just to. Yeah. I don't know. I can't find a. Unless I spelling it wrong. Clear coding.

Nicole [00:51:21]: Clear coding.

John [00:51:23]: Let's put the dash in there and see if that comes up with some kind of article or something. But I mean, is there a deeper definition of it that you have? No, I mean honest and transparent.

Nicole [00:51:37]: That's. So I guess it's like what you want.

John [00:51:41]: Yeah.

Nicole [00:51:42]: Being like, I'm looking for a relationship I think would be clear coding, but you do need some parentheses, non parentheses, shalons.

John [00:51:52]: I can't even find this term anywhere. But I mean, because it's probably because we're not in 2026, so maybe. Yeah.

Nicole [00:52:01]: But, yeah, I think it's just being transparent. But I think that, like you said with the, like, Chalons nonchalance is that I feel like you can be honest and transparent, but you also don't want to floodlight. So it's like you have to read the room. And the room of any date is not tell your life story.

John [00:52:21]: Well, okay, let me put it this. Let me say this, though, because I just thought about this, which relates to the other thing too. It is good to use a strategic vulnerability in order to create a greater connection and bond with someone, but not in a manipulative way, in order to get something from them. Right. So if I'm meeting someone even on, like, on a sales call, right, when I'm trying to build rapport, build a connection, I might share something vulnerable about myself because it shows that I'm a real person, that I care, and it allows them to be more vulnerable. That's a good tactic in making friends, in dating, in a relationship. It's just that when you use that strategically in order to create an artificial bond. Right. So it's the same thing with the clear coating. Like, it's good to be transparent to a degree and to share some vulnerability, but it's not good to be totally. Everything is on the table, like we said before, and revealing all the cards.

Nicole [00:53:26]: Until you get further into dating that person.

John [00:53:29]: Yeah.

Nicole [00:53:31]: Let's move on.

John [00:53:32]: Okay.

Nicole [00:53:32]: Because I think that is pretty obvious. Friend fluence, I think, you know, okay.

John [00:53:37]: We know we don't need to look that one up.

Nicole [00:53:39]: Like, it's what you said earlier about your friends influencing your decision. And I think this one's complicated because I think everyone should listen to what their friends has to say, like, physically. But I don't think you should do everything that your friends have to say about who you're dating or whatever. I think it's important to hear people out and their opinions. But I think at the end of the day, you have to know what you. You're the only one who knows best what you like and what kind of relationship you want to have. Like, obviously, if your friend is like, hey, I saw the guy you're dating with some other, you should listen to what they have to say. But if they're shreking, I don't know. He just seems like something's off. Like, maybe that is true. But you can still make the choice whether you also feel like something's off or whether you still want to Date that person and.

John [00:54:37]: And friends will mess up your relationships. Not necessarily even intentionally, but because psychologically, subconsciously, everyone knows that when you start dating someone, they're going to see less of you and you're going to start to move your loyalties in the direction of your romantic interest instead of your friend interest. Because that happens and that's supposed to happen. That's a natural progression. And at the point that when you're in a relationship with someone, especially when you're married, then anyone who interferes with that, friends or otherwise, is going to get excommunicado out of your life. So that is sort of the threat thing. Plus, also, you can't do the single person shit, so it's going to ruin the fun. So there is a bit of that element as well. And there's some jealousy oftentimes too, when you have someone that's desirable that you're dating. So the friends. Complicated. You have to be careful. But you definitely can't be the kind of person that allows what other people think about the person that you're dating to dictate what you think. For sure.

Nicole [00:55:37]: Yeah.

John [00:55:38]: Because that.

Nicole [00:55:39]: We wouldn't be here if that was the case. One of my really close friends, when you sent me one of the videos early on, was like, I don't know, he does YouTube. And I was like, I think he's a good person. I'm going to stick with it.

John [00:55:51]: Yeah. And I sent one of my friends 4 pictures of girls and be like, which one of them should I.

Nicole [00:55:57]: And he did not pick. Not Tinder up with.

John [00:56:03]: I'm trying to make it family friendly on the podcast, but he picked the wrong one. And I was like, are you crazy? But I definitely didn't listen to him.

Nicole [00:56:14]: Well, you didn't Tinder Up.

John [00:56:15]: That's right. All right.

Nicole [00:56:18]: But yeah, so it's a. It's a delicate balance. I agree. I think that. But if you value your friends, like, even when my friend was like, I don't know, he does YouTube, I'm like, I hear what you're saying, but I was the one that went on two dates with you prior to that or three dates. Yeah, I know you better than they do. You know what I mean? And that was early on. Yeah.

John [00:56:39]: There was. She. I mean, some of her instincts were correct, though, like.

Nicole [00:56:45]: Do you want me here or not? What do you want?

John [00:56:48]: I'm just saying she knew there was something. Something weird about. About me.

Nicole [00:56:52]: Yeah.

John [00:56:53]: Turned out to be true.

Nicole [00:56:54]: Was. But I love him.

John [00:56:57]: But you did love me. And I did love You. So there you go.

Nicole [00:57:00]: But, yeah, but, yeah, but what I'm trying to say though is, is that even though. Yes. Maybe she was right and I didn't see the things.

John [00:57:09]: Yeah.

Nicole [00:57:09]: But if I had listened to her, we wouldn't be here.

John [00:57:11]: Exactly. Yeah. Yeah.

Nicole [00:57:13]: So I had to listen to my own instinct. And I guess that's the thing is like you need to trust your own instinct on a lot of especially like romantic relationships. Like obviously if you're in like an abusive relationship and your friends are like, he literally treats you like crap or whatever, like that's different. But just being like, oh, I don't know, things seem a little fishy like.

John [00:57:37]: Yeah. Or making fun of like their physical appearance or something like that. Because that happens right? Where you're bullied out of someone.

Nicole [00:57:46]: You could do so much better. He's ugly or whatever.

John [00:57:49]: She's ugly, got a lazy eye or cross eyed or whatever.

Nicole [00:57:51]: It's like, like I like lazy eyes.

John [00:57:53]: Yes.

Nicole [00:57:54]: That's what I'm looking for in a man.

John [00:57:56]: But I think it's more, more the younger you are, the more susceptible you are to this. Right. The in terms of like, you know, someone's making fun of your, your dating prospect and then you're like, okay, well I don't like them because other people are making fun of them.

Nicole [00:58:11]: Yeah.

John [00:58:11]: Yeah.

Nicole [00:58:12]: So yeah. But I mean this one is hard because I feel like it is a delicate balance because I've definitely had some girlfriends too that have dated guys that were not good for them, like did not treat them well and you know, they weren't abusive but they weren't the right person for them and they still stuck by that person. So it's like. And honestly, as a friend, at that point, if you speak your truth or whatever you feel is the truth, you also have to respect your friend's decision even if you don't agree with it.

John [00:58:44]: Right. Yeah.

Nicole [00:58:44]: You know, like it is their life. So you know, if your friends are really pushing you for something again, unless it's like you're being abused and you're just like delulu to it or something. I don't know. That would be the only thing where I feel like a friend would like keep going. But if your friends keep pushing you and nothing like that's going on, no abusive stuff, then like that is a time to have a conversation with your friends because that's kind of overstepping.

John [00:59:11]: Yeah.

Nicole [00:59:11]: And they need to respect your decision and yeah. Not be so much trying to influence your decision with their. Just the way that they Feel.

John [00:59:23]: Yeah, well, and, and also if you are the friend, you have to be smart about this too. Because if your friend is dating someone and then you express your dislike for that person or disinterest and then they end up marrying that person, for instance, or whatever, or getting into a serious relationship, guess who's gonna be the first person on the. Yeah, it's gonna be you. Because it's not gonna fly. Like you can't be the. So it's like you can express some concern or whatever, you have to be careful how you do it. But if you're like whatever, you say some nasty stuff about them, then when that person does get into a relationship, you're gone.

Nicole [01:00:03]: Yeah, but people in relationships too, that's also why you should really try to keep the things to yourself as much as possible. I'm not saying you can't ever talk about things to your friends, but you, you know the dynamic more than anybody else. And so your friend also isn't going to have the full picture of what's going on. It's going to be a biased, one sided part of the story. So. And most of the time they're gonna vouch for you anyway. That's why you said too, like, if you're talking bad about your partner, then they're going to think bad about your partner because they are also your friend. They want to support you, they want to be there for you. So also like making sure that you choose what you want to share with your friends that wouldn't be harmful to your relationship or paint your partner in a bad light because you're giving them the picture of your partner when you just complain.

John [01:01:00]: Right. Well, and a good friend is like a good therapist. Right? A bad therapist, when you complain about what's going on in your life says, oh yeah, you're right. Like these people are such jerks. That person must have narcissism, must be an NPD or whatever it is. Right? Right. A good therapist says, okay, okay, I understand what's going on and I'm sorry that this is happening to you and you feel this way, but what do you think your part in this is? Or why do you think this is upsetting you so much? Or let's dig down into what do you think you could do about this situation. A good friend does the same thing. A good friend is not going to when you complain. Well, first of all, you shouldn't be complaining about your spouse or significant other. You should be explaining the situation and how you feel about it. But a good friend is not going to be like, oh, yeah, he's a jerk. I can't believe he did that. That's not good friend behavior. A good friend is going to say, okay, well, yeah, I get that he did that and that made you feel that way, but what do you think you could do in the future? Or how do you think you should handle the situation? Or why does that affect you so much asking those kind of questions? Or how can I help you? As opposed to let's. Let's reinforce your negative viewpoints of the world which divides the relationship.

Nicole [01:02:22]: That's true. All right, we still have two more, so we gotta.

John [01:02:25]: All right, we'll do speed.

Nicole [01:02:26]: Hot take dating. Hot dash take dating.

John [01:02:29]: All right. Do you know what this one is?

Nicole [01:02:31]: No.

John [01:02:33]: What do you think it is?

Nicole [01:02:34]: I think just being blunt and saying things that people wouldn't say while you're dating, like while on dates.

John [01:02:44]: I don't know if I'm even gonna be able to find this one. Oh, a hot take in dating is a controversial or unexpected opinion meant to spark conversation, revealing personality beyond small talk.

Nicole [01:02:56]: Is that like hot take? I think the earth is flat.

John [01:02:59]: I don't think that's like, oh, is hot take danding? Oh, here we go. Psychology Today. Is hot take dating a trend to follow?

Nicole [01:03:07]: Well, what is it?

John [01:03:08]: I'm waiting for it to come. Okay. Hot take dating is about putting forth your most extreme, most divisive viewpoints as soon as possible. Such hot takes can help quickly see whether you and the other person are compatible. Hot take dating might increase dating efficiency, save time, improve communication, and teach you new things. Risks include getting negative reactions, hotly contested arguments, and potential hot messes. This seems pretty stupid to me. I'm not going to lie.

Nicole [01:03:35]: I mean, I think I hot take dated a little bit back in the day.

John [01:03:41]: Okay, how did that work out for you?

Nicole [01:03:43]: I have a husband.

John [01:03:46]: Look, all right, here's.

Nicole [01:03:48]: I have a hot, buff husband. I think it worked out pretty well.

John [01:03:51]: It's like they have pineapples belong on pizza. The hottest.

Nicole [01:03:54]: That is not hot take.

John [01:03:56]: It's the best film ever. I mean, I think they're trying to downplay the things. But look, pineapples do belong on pizza. Since we're short on time, I'll just be blunt with it, which is that you don't go on a date and be like, I voted for Trump or I voted for Obama. Very stupid idea. There's no point in doing that.

Nicole [01:04:10]: It's a political hot take.

John [01:04:12]: Yeah, that's what most people hot take on. You don't need to be say your most controversial thing. Because here's the thing. If you're truly compatible, those things are, even the things that you have hot takes on, they're not going to matter. And plus, all the stuff that you normally have that you probably have a hot take on, it's just because you're an idiot.

Nicole [01:04:30]: But it matters.

John [01:04:30]: If you're holding strongly polarizing views on subjects, you're an idiot. Like, don't tell people on the date that you're an idiot. Like, you know, because. And the reason why I say that.

Nicole [01:04:41]: So they can find out later that you're an idiot.

John [01:04:43]: Because. Yeah. There's no point to just reveal that you're an idiot.

Nicole [01:04:46]: Yeah, it saves time because like, because.

John [01:04:49]: Because intelligent people don't have a whole. They don't have a whole bunch of hot take. They might have views and. But they're open. So the thing is, you just dump. I believe this, whatever it is, your religious or your political view on someone over time, as you know the person, you could have better conversations to understand each other's viewpoints as opposed to just dumping the thing on them and then being like, oh, next filter. Oh, I'm not dating anyone who has this belief. That's just ridiculous.

Nicole [01:05:26]: Well, I also viewed, when you described it, I said I used to hot take date because I would ask people maybe sometimes on the first date if they wanted to have kids or not, and if they said no, then I would not date them anymore. Okay, so you're saying like, just blurting things out is hot take dating? I'm saying asking a question that would determine whether still dating that person early on, I would ask that question and people would say that that's a hot. That asking about kids early on is a hot take.

John [01:05:59]: We've talked about this one though, before because I think that, I mean, that makes sense logically to ask that question. That's a very filtering question. However, I think that it's a more complex issue because if you ask me, would I like to have kids, might.

Nicole [01:06:16]: Have a kid already that you don't know about.

John [01:06:18]: Okay, all right. Yeah. But if you ask me, would I want to have kids? Yeah, it depends on who I'm with, which I would. It depends on the strength of the relationship. It depends on.

Nicole [01:06:32]: But that's an acceptable answer.

John [01:06:33]: Yeah, but most people don't have the, the self. What's the word?

Nicole [01:06:38]: Awareness.

John [01:06:39]: Awareness.

Nicole [01:06:39]: Well, then they're not for me to.

John [01:06:41]: Know that that is true because some people would say, like, you could, you could talk to a woman and she'd be like, I'm not interested in having kids. But okay, two factors can happen. One, the biological clock can start to tick when she gets into her 30s. And number two, she might date a guy that she actually wants to have kids with. That can change. Or someone might say, oh, I absolutely do want to have kids. Well, what is the temperature of the relationship? Would you want to have kids with a person who you don't have a good relationship with?

Nicole [01:07:13]: In that case, totally fine with any of those answers. But normally people that say no, I'm also not going to convince them. And I'm not going to want to stick around and see if I can convince them.

John [01:07:23]: I think though asking that question because is because someone could say no, but that might not actually be the case. I would say date them for some period of time and then see where they're at on it. And if they're saying if you're gonna get into a much more serious situation, you're. And they're like, absolutely, I'm, I wouldn't, I'm not having kids, then yeah. Then you're like, okay, well, you know, then you break it off before it's gotten too, too serious. But I would say leading out of the gate with that is, is not like it's gonna filter out some choices that could be good.

Nicole [01:07:57]: Nobody should do it unless they have the level of chalons and nonchalance that I had because it is like you said, a delicate thing. But also if someone's telling me no right away, like I said, I would accept that answer. And I'm not like, then it's just not, it's not for me. If you don't even know that you can explain it in a more in depth way. I would actually prefer a more in depth answer than yes or no to that question. So. But on the hot take dating going kind of back a little bit because we tangented a little bit. But I agree with you that I don't think you have to say all your hot takes.

John [01:08:39]: Yeah.

Nicole [01:08:40]: Outright. And I don't think that you should become uninterested in somebody for their hot takes unless it's obviously like a very, very, very concerning hot take. Because I feel like hot take dating feeds into you're either with us or against us. And then if you're looking for somebody that agrees with every hot take that you have, like that's very unrealistic and also very close minded. And so it's giving fixed mindset instead of growth mindset. Like you said, if you're like throwing out all these hot takes and seeing if someone just agrees with you. Because I think people confuse being totally alike with being compatible. And that's not what it is. Like, yes, on like moral things, morals, not hot takes, you should be aligned with, like morally how you live your life and things like that. Those should be more aligned. But random opinions and decisions on certain things that may or may not change. I would not base my whole relationship off of hot takes.

John [01:09:50]: Well, what's the purpose of relationship? Love? Well, no, what else?

Nicole [01:09:57]: Connection.

John [01:09:58]: Like, what does it do for you? Like, why get in a relationship?

Nicole [01:10:03]: I mean, it's like having someone there for you all the time.

John [01:10:08]: Growth.

Nicole [01:10:10]: And growth and growth.

John [01:10:12]: But growth. So, so, so like what you're saying.

Nicole [01:10:15]: There'S so many purposes, but I'm saying like, you know, the mirror, the mirroring things to grow and heal from.

John [01:10:22]: You need a relationship in order to grow. You're not going to grow. And so the whole thing is that if you're filtering people based off of your hot takes, then that's not a growing. You're actually making it so you can't grow because you're not going to grow with people that are completely 100% in agreement with you, incompatible with you 100%. You're going to grow where there's some difficulty and it's not a perfect match in the, in that respect. Right?

Nicole [01:10:50]: Yeah.

John [01:10:51]: You know, so the growth comes from that, the, the struggle. Just like, you know, that's why our podcast is what it's called. Right.

Nicole [01:10:58]: So that's true.

John [01:10:58]: Yeah.

Nicole [01:10:59]: Okay, last one.

John [01:10:59]: All right, last one.

Nicole [01:11:01]: Emotional vibe coding.

John [01:11:04]: Oh, God, I don't, I don't even.

Nicole [01:11:07]: Know where to start with this. Do you emotional vibe coding.

John [01:11:12]: I mean, I.

Nicole [01:11:15]: Talking about your emotions.

John [01:11:17]: Emotional vibe coding blends AI driven development with human intuition. Focusing on the feeling and experience of software, not just function. Using prompts to shape a output.

Nicole [01:11:28]: This isn't dating.

John [01:11:30]: Mood, tone and user centric.

Nicole [01:11:33]: Did you put dating?

John [01:11:36]: I mean, I put emotional vibe coding.

Nicole [01:11:39]: No, I think you need to put dating because that's like care about the AI's emotions, which AI does not have emotions.

John [01:11:44]: It's saying to like to manipulate the AI to give you the emotional response that you want. Okay, Emotional vibe coding. Is it in dating? Is a 2026 trend? I don't know. Possible because we're not. Okay. They're predicting where daters ditch game playing for authentic, clear and emotionally honest interactions. Seeking partners who are emotionally available and drama free. Valuing empathy and straightforwardness over cryptic Messages or over analyzing, often with low pressure dates. It's about being real with your intentions, communicating feelings openly and finding a genuine connection influenced by a fatigue with situationships and a desire for deeper compatibility.

Nicole [01:12:22]: Okay, here's, here's the thing. I really hate calling dating a game or like it's a game, like we talked about earlier in this episode. But I think people misconstrue the game part because they think that it means it's inauthentic.

John [01:12:39]: Right?

Nicole [01:12:40]: And maybe we need to do a whole nother episode on like how dating is a game and really explain it. Because I think if you really understand it the way that you and I do, it's not a game. That means that you're just lying and withholding information and manipulating people. That's not what it is.

John [01:13:01]: Not risk or you haven't played Risk.

Nicole [01:13:04]: No, but it's, it's not a game in that way. It is a game in the sense of like, you have to be strategic about what you're doing authentically. Like, it's never about being authentic inauthentic. It's about being authentic but not telling somebody your whole life story when you haven't even realized if you like them or not.

John [01:13:28]: Well, look, okay, here, analogy, right to the game. If you play a game that has hidden information, let's say Clue. Clue is a very basic game, okay? The game will not be fun if you show everyone what your cards are in Clue. It won't be fun. It will be very authentic and transparent. But no one is going to want to play that game because it's just not going to be fun fun. So in Clue, when you don't show people what you have, what your cards are, whatever the hidden information, it's not mean, it's not manipulative, it's not deceptive. It's just to make the game enjoyable because that's why we're playing the game. And it's the same thing with dating. It's not a bad thing that it's a game. People are like, try to be too transparent and all this stuff. No, it's going to take all the fun out of it. The whole point of flirting and going on a date is that I don't know if I like this person. I don't know if they like me. I'm learning this thing about them. I hope he texts me. It builds the anticipation, which is important because if you're just like, okay, here's my spreadsheet of things that I like. Here's yours, and here's all of my history, and are we compatible? Am I attracted to you? I would rate you as an eight. Oh, you rated me as a seven. Okay, we're good. It won't be very fun. So.

Nicole [01:14:53]: Yeah. And I do think dating should be fun. But I also think, too, that, like, viewing the game part of it in the way that a lot of people do is just. I don't know how to describe it. Like, they're so worried about it being a game and that it being inauthentic, that they're, like you said, showing all their cards, and they think, like, this is the way to be, but it's too much, too soon for majority of people to just straight up, like, be like, okay, I'm ready for a relationship. What do you want? Like, interview style? That's not what people actually want either. So that's why we're trying to explain that it's a game in the sense of you're having fun with it. You're not lying to people, but you're not telling your whole life story on the first date. You're actually getting to know each other. You're taking it step by step. You don't play a game, like you said, and you're like, show all your cards and like, boom, done. You don't play Mario, and you go straight to Bowser's castle. No, you have to go through all these things first. Like, it is a game in the sense of, like, you're not just at the finish line.

John [01:16:03]: Right. That's what builds investment. Because. And that's a good way of looking at it, because, like, even in the game of Clue, when you start the game, there's no investment.

Nicole [01:16:12]: Right.

John [01:16:12]: It's just. It doesn't matter. Like, if you started the game of Clue and then. And then everyone's like, actually, we don't want to play. You're like, okay, well, it's not a big deal. Right. But if you're, like, halfway through the game and then someone's like, I don't really want to play anymore. You're like, no, we want to play it out because you're invested in it.

Nicole [01:16:30]: Right.

John [01:16:31]: And so you got to create an investment.

Nicole [01:16:33]: Right, Exactly. So we'll have to do a full episode on that. I think on the game, we could have a full conversation about that, but we've gone over this one, so. Yeah, but that's your dating terms and information for wrapping up 2025 and for 2026.

John [01:16:53]: Yeah. Now you can be hip with all the lingo.

Nicole [01:16:56]: Yeah.

John [01:16:57]: All right. I think we should just wrap this one because we're.

Nicole [01:17:00]: Yeah.

John [01:17:00]: Over time. And then we'll hit our end segment on the next one. All right, guys, if you have a question for us and we haven't answered it already or whatever, you can email us at betterthanperfectpodcastmail.com or visit our website at betterthanperfectpod.com and we'll see you next week.

Nicole [01:17:20]: Bye.